Thanksgiving. Eat, drink, and be thankful. Felt good. Many of us got together with family/friends. Conversation: for some of us, with folks we don't get to see or talk with a lot. Many of us just wanted to turn off Y2K for a while, some may have seen an opportunity to raise the subject with a loved one for the first time.

Y2K came up. Talked about the upcoming 60 minutes show the most. Question: Do you think they will treat the subject fairly? Most had an opinion, ranging from it will be 'don't worry, be happy' to it will be balanced and fair. No one thought the show would talk about the possiblility of TEOTWAWKI in any serious way... only raise this in order to poke fun at or discredit the idea. Reason: If 60 minutes started seriously talking about TEOTWAWKI as a real possibility, it could precipitate a panic of some kind, perhaps in the banks or stock market. Observation:This was one thing on which everyone agreed.

All of this is guess work. Just wanted to pass it along, and find out if You had any interesting Y2K conversations.

-- Rob Michaels (sonofdust@net.com), November 26, 1998

Answers

How many movies have come out in the past two years portraying doom and gloom and "what could happen?" Everything from a meteor hitting earth to being invaded by flying saucers. Well it hasn't happened yet, nor has Y2K and all the doom and gloom that's going to come with it. So why should people listen or even entertain the idea that anything bad is going to happen? As far as many are concerned, it's just another scenario, a prediction, another movie in the making. We see murder everyday on T.V. and we become immune to it. It will be the same with Y2K. Most people don't understand the implications of Y2K, so they shrug it off as an impossibility. As we get closer and closer to the year 2000 we will either be proved to be right or off our rockers.

-- bardou (bardou@baloeny.com), November 26, 1998.

Rob, I'm really glad you started this thread, because I was wondering the same thing. Y2K did come up at our family gathering today. (Large family, only one sister "Gets It.") There were some of the usual remarks, but then my dad surprised me (and REALLY surprised the rest) by what he said. I have been working on him for awhile. As of 2 months ago, he said he would probably take some money out of the bank in late December 1999 just to be safe. Well, today, he said, "I'm going to take my money out of the bank in August 1999."

I'm going to keep working on him to move it up even further, but the look on the other family member's faces was priceless!! :-)

-- Gayla Dunbar (privacy@please.com), November 26, 1998.

Bardou- Excellent point. I 100% agree.

We don't have Thanksgiving in Australia, but I was out with some friends and took the opportunity to poll them for what they thought would happen with y2k.

Interesting answers.

Two people expect all hell to break loose, a 10 (although they didn't put it in those terms and probably wouldn't understand the term "TEOTWAWKI"). One of them wants it to happen because he wants "some action in my life", the other thinks that "we're due for something, and this will probably be it."

Someone else expects the Australian police to impose martial law in case a few things go wrong.

None of those 3 are preparing.

The other six people I spoke to didn't expect more than minor disruptions, if that. "They won't let it happen", "Microsoft is hiding a solution. They'll reveal it late next year so they can make the most cash", and all the other ones that I won't re-repeat here.

The scary thing is that those 6 people would all be top 10% of the population, intelligence-wise; a couple of them have IQs in the 140s. And THEY -intelligent achievers- don't know. When I told them about sites to go to, just to get more information, they said they couldn't be bothered because they knew it was unneccessary. (THAT is not intelligent. An intelligent person would check out all possibilities.)

I dread to think what the general masses are thinking right now..

(da da da-da-da-HEY!-da-da-dada ??)

--Leo

-- Leo (leo_champion@hotmail.com), November 27, 1998.

I could've won next month's Duh-2000 contest

-- Arthur Rambo (buriedtreasure@webtv.net), November 27, 1998.

Actually, After I gave everyone an audio tape and lots of information, they were willing to investigate. But in the beginning, everyone had already decided the outcome. My favorite line: How do I know this info isn't put out by someone whose trying to sell me a well bucket or something?

-- Arthur Rambo (buriedtreasure@webtv.net), November 27, 1998.

Gayla: Did you have the camera handy? LOL. I'm thinking of showing the "Know your Customer" stuff to some folks. They probably won't believe it, (still not sure I do) but maybe it'll get 'em thinking. If I do I'll let you know... could help get 'dad' up to April!

-- Rob Michaels (sonofdust@net.com), November 27, 1998.

I suppose most of the y2k conversations I've heard can be summed up by quoting the great lyrics of Lieber and Stoller (dunno who wrote what) "yackety yak, don't talk back". Whatever that means.

How come they're the greatest US song writers of all time (for the same reason Mcdonald's are the definitive US food I suppose). Yeah I know we have Len and Macca/ fish and chips, I'm not proud of it.

-- Richard Dale (rdale@figroup.co.uk), November 27, 1998.

Well the fact that 60 minutes is going to cover it has people waiting until Sunday. No one is preparing, but at least they ARE thinking about it.

A good friend wants to sell her apartment condo now. Also sees Y2K as a call to be the best we can be and start re-focusing our priorities on what is important in life. Admits she hates her job and it is time to stop doing something that only drags her down.

Diane

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), November 27, 1998.

No one in my family wants to hear it. Received a "yeak, well anythings possible." Talked to my sister in AZ too. She's tired of hearing about it. Wants people to stop talking about it. What's talking going to do anyway? The media is hyping it up, the government is trying to scare us, etc. etc. She won't listen, talks about preparing, but won't. Same old same old.

-- Christine A. Newbie (vaganti01@aol.com), November 27, 1998.

"talks about preparing but won't"

The problem is, what do even WE (self-diagnosed as "getting it") mean by "preparing" ? This is what confuses newbies, or SHOULD confuse them. I mean, are we "safe" if we have 2 weeks of food and some stored water ? 4 weeks ? 1 year ? How much water ? How many guns, how much ammo ? Ammo reloading ? How much gasoline ? Shell-making metal-work tools ? Raw materials ? Medicine ? Gasoline ? If 1 week, why not 2 ? If 1 month why not 3 ? How much can we store before FEMA takes it (and us) under "anti hoarding" laws ? Do we need to plan for a full para-military 24/7 operation ? For how long ? Under whose command ? If not, why not ? Or should we plan to re-constitute a whole new (militarily-based) local economy ?

I read a guy's posting on Gary North, said he lives in a small town, rural area of central Arkansas, has 24 acres, trees, pond, hunting, fishing, large garden, everyone in town knows each other, etc. Sounds ideal, right ? NO! He was asking when and to where he should BUG OUT ! This is the American dream. We always think the promised land is over the next hill. Pretty soon we'll end up like "The Grapes of Wrath" where people relocating from OK to CA were meeting Okies coming back from CA to "re-re-locate" back to OK.

-RC

"The second amendement is no more about duck hunting than the first is about Scrabble." - John Ross

-- Run W. Cat (runway_cat@hotmail.com), November 27, 1998.

I understand the confusion about what to prepare for, how long are things going to be down, what systems are going to be down, and then: if what systems go down for how long, what's the impact on "me" - that's the worst part, not knowing.

Can sympathize with the guy in Arkansas (AR abbreviation, right ?) - but don't understand it. Seems like he's in good spot, ought to put up canned goods, cut some wood, and get a solar still.

And like Diane reminds, get to know his neighbors.

-- Robert A. Cook, P.E. (Kennesaw, GA) (cook.r@csaatl.com), November 27, 1998.

RC, No, no, not CA! Please, go somewhere else...Oregon, Washington, Idaho, Montana? CA is overloaded enough, 'sides we've got earthquakes in addition to Y2K. Trembles just yesterday and in Mexico a volcano along the "ring of fire" is smoking. Any bets on which hits CA first? Volcano, earthquake or Y2K?

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), November 27, 1998.

Earthquake!

-- Gayla Dunbar (privacy@please.com), November 27, 1998.

UMMMM Neighbor Volcano triggers local earthquake on New Years Evil???

I talked to my brother on teh phone TGiving Day. He works at the same level as Cory, but in different areas. (given his DOD eperience, I'm Really surprised he didn't know Cory, but..) Anyway, he had read Ed Y's essays and his comment was "Most people have read them, and said 'SO...' and moved on...." DAMN I thought he was gonna be the EASY sale Christmas.

Chuck

-- Chuck etc (rienzoo@en.com), November 27, 1998.

Miss Diane,

You're overlooking the good news there. When the volcano fills the LA basin completely, there won't be any polution that can be trapped by the mountains, because the former basin will be higher thatn the mountains, so you get to go skiing year round, and so all the polution "rolls" downhill towards the sea and there won't be any more overcrowding because there's lots of new land to fill up .....

-- Robert A. Cook, P.E. (Kennesaw, GA) (cook.r@csaatl.com), November 27, 1998.

Run W. Cat: Regarding your comments about preparing: Many good questions you asked, so did I... came to the conclusion that preparation never ends, in part since our analysis of the threat to us from Y2K never ends. The threat is why we prepare. We don't have all the info we need. Nobody does. But many of us have come to the conclusion it's going to be bad enough that we need to do something, and do it Now. We have enough info to come to an opinion and act on it.

BTW, this doesn't confuse just the newbies. How we prepare depends on our individual assessment of what the Y2K impacts will be. We are all guessing, even if it is intelligent guessing. Don't feel bad. You aren't alone. I think Robert is right when he posted that the worst part is not knowing. This whole subject still gets to me. It was this that casued me to stop lurking and start posting. First question I ever asked was: Does preparation ever end? Sorry, I'm starting to ramble. It just bothers the heck out of me that no matter how much info we get we still don't know that much. The good thing is that we do know enough to recognize the threat and take action...even if the details elude us. Gut feel counts for a lot too.

Robert: " all the polution rolls downhill towards the sea and there won't be any more overcrowding because there's lots of new land to fill up "

Yeh, but it's going to be awful tough of all those little fishes!

-- Rob Michaels (sonofdust@net.com), November 27, 1998.

Robert, the landfill is the worst place to rebuild on after a quake and before another one. In the '89 S.F. quake one of the hardest hit areas was the land-filled Marina district. Fortunately we also have a good amount of sort-of solid granite out here.

Yes, Gayla, I suspect we'll get an earthquake or two before Y2K too.

Have you ever wondered how the consciousness and thoughts of people on the planet impacts or exacerbates the weather & earth movement patterns? I have. In fact, as Y2K captures our attention next year, I predict the weather will become correspondingly "dicey."

Diane

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), November 27, 1998.

Of course granite is best to build on Diane,

...that's why I recommended wating until _after_ the LA basin is filled with the lava from the volcano before you build. Did you think I was saying build "before" the lava flows stopped? That'd be like totally, like a radically " Pompei'ed" idea, man. 8<).

-- Robert A. Cook, P.E. (Kennesaw, GA) (cook.r@csaatl.com), November 27, 1998.

I didn't bother trying to discuss Y2K at Thanksgiving dinner. (The host, my stepson, is sure we are nuts for worrying about something that his computer-expert buddy has assured him will be no big deal.) However, my other stepson, handicapped and not too smart, and his wife rode to dinner with us and we plied them with info, which they believe. They want to prepare, but sadly, are disabled and on welfare. I explained that they now have something of great value that many rich people don't have: advance warning. Today I printed out and sent them some Y2K info. They intend to prepare to the best of their limited abilities. It's "success" stories like this that keep me spreading the word.

-- Pearlie Sweetcake (storestuff@home.now), November 27, 1998.

responses:

- general agreement that it'll be nice to see the fedgov go down for the long count.

- several people who openly acknowledge that the DC metro area will not be healthy, and who seem to get it, but are doing nothing in the way of preparation.

and

- several of adults who shared looks of realization that this was the *last* thanksgiving that would be like this, due to relocations prior to the next one...

Arlin Adams

-- Arlin H. Adams (ahadams@ix.netcom.com), November 27, 1998.

Just returned from Thanksgiving with my family. After dinner, my partner and I brought up Y2K. My elderly parents (especially my mother) are preparing, though my Dad is still skeptical. My Mom is stocking a pantry. My big task is to convince my Dad not to convert the fireplace to gas.... My older sister is preparing. Told my younger sister and her husband. First they'd heard of it. They were wide-eyed and said they'd better get busy stocking canned goods.... My 16 year old niece said that her history teacher talked about it in class. All in all, not a bad response to our Y2K conversation! There is hope folks. Some are ready to hear.

-- Libby Alexander (libbyalex@aol.com), November 28, 1998.

We drove 4 hours to have Thanksgiving dinner with 30-odd some extended family members (as we do every year). We discussed Y2k at great length the evening before and we all then decided that there would be a "moratorium" on Y2k topics during the dinner and on Thanksgiving day itself. It actually worked well. We have several family members who are so in denial that they just don't want to hear about it. Those of us who are seriously preparing (my father and mother-in-law, and all the brothers but one, sister-in-law, and most of the cousins and one of the aunts) stuck to the "moratorium" rule, though it just about *killed* some of us to stay silent that day. Then the next day we gathered together and had some great conversations about our different preparations and shared ideas on different ways to deal with problems, etc. It was really great and my husband and myself are now heartened that *most* of the family is taking it seriously and preparing. By the way, as recently as three months ago, not one of them would even listen to us about it. Now *most* of them *get it*. :-)

-- Bobbi (volfnat@northweb.com), November 29, 1998.

"We have several family members who are so in denial that they just don't want to hear about it."

Bobbi: You may want to look at the new thread that talks about Don't get its - Is one of them someone you know. You will find pshannon's addition of the DWGI category interesting I think. Keep preparing and good luck with the DWGIs and FGIs and DGIs.

-- Rob Michaels (sonofdust@net.com), November 29, 1998.

Husband finally doesn't roll his eyes anymore when I mention y2k & preparations. Two & a half hours of driving to my mom's gave me alot of good "captive" time to really talk to him with no interuptions. What really changed his opinion? The article about the FDIC & the banks. He was not happy about that at all.

My mom & brother think that I've "lost it" & am way over-reacting & do not want to hear any more about y2k. I've been sending them info & trying to help them see the potential for trouble & the need to prepare "in case"... My brother wanted to make me a sign with Y2K in a circle with a slash thru it. Kinda hurt my feelings because I don't want them to be "hurt" by what's coming. I know of course that they could come around, I just hope its not too late when they do. Other that that we had a very nice Thanksgiving. Happy Holidays to everone!! Donna

-- Donna in Texas (Dd0143@aol.com), November 30, 1998.