I was wondering if anyone could give me some advice on processing Tri-X film. I usually use TMX/TMY or Delta 100/400. I get great negative densities from these films developed in ID-11 1:1, using a water stop bath, ilford rapid fix 1:3 for 5 minutes, and a rinse(@dev. temp) of 5 minutes.

A few days ago, a friend asked me to develop a roll of her Tri-X, so I looked up approximate developing times, and went to work with the chemicals listed above. I have found that using a film squeegee has no adverse effects on the Deltas, and some effect(must be slow, gentle and careful otherwise slight scratching) with the TMX and TMY. I have never had a problem with emulsion or negative scratching or peeling. However, when I pulled the Tri-X from the final rinse, the emulsion side felt slimy. When at first I tried to squeegee the film(luckily it was on non-framed portion of the film) I noticed the emulsion peeled away. So, I gently wiped the film with a sponge and let it air dry. When the film dried, I noticed some spotting, and a line of stress where the emulsion seemed to shrink. However, the negative densities where right on, and there was no discoloration on the film. My question is: does Tri-X require longer fix times or treatment with a hardening agent? Why did I not see these results with the TMX and TMY?

I should note that I also used the same temps for the Tri-X that I did for the TMX, TMY. Thanks very much for any information you may be able to give.

-Paul

-- Paul Klingaman (Paul.Klingaman@seagatesoftware.com), April 16, 1999

Answers

Sounds like you were just unlucky with an *extremely* uncommon occurrence: faulty Kodak film! I've developed hundreds of rolls of TX over the years in D-76 1:1 (kissing cousin to ID-11), and have never seen this situation.

BTW 1: I gave up on squeegeeing film years ago. A quick dunk in a very dilute PhotoFlo solution, then taking the film out of the tray and hanging it up IN ONE SWIFT MOTION has been working fine. Pressing rubber to a wet emulsion just seems like asking for trouble...

BTW 2: You might have overdeveloped slightly. At least in D-76 1:1 at 68, TMX and TMY go for 12 and 12-1/2 mins, respectively, and Tri-X only goes for 10. Luckily, with TX's legendary latitude and wide tolerance of errors, this should barely make a difference!

-- Michael Goldfarb (mgoldfar@mobius-inc.com), April 19, 1999.

Paul, I don't know much about TMX/TMY as I have only used them a few times. The standard rules should apply to those as well as Tri-X. Never squeege film. I gave that up long ago when I got tired of touching up the scratch lines off the prints. I recommend very weak foto flow solution in distilled water (2-3 drops per gallon). You can use the distilled water over and over as the final rinse after regular washing. Then hang in a dust free place. Weak foto flow prevents soap film and distilled water prevents water spots. It's worth the 2 hour wait for flawless negs unless you are a photojournalist and need to print pronto. In that case try a hair dryer on cool setting after fotoflow rinse. Watch out for dust. Greg

-- Greg Augustine (wca@idt.net), April 19, 1999.

NO FAULTY FILM HERE!

this in some way was your fault. all the info isnt here for the correct answer.. only you know what you did.

i will guess that either your developer was mixed improperly, or your developer temp was too high. either of these problems will cause the emultion to swell. bad film causes no such problems.

its also possible that your developer could have come bad from the manufacture. this would mean that the developer was shy or didnt have any sulfate in the mix. the sulfate is what keeps the emultion from swelling.

what you should have done when you took the film out of the wash, and felt it was heavy, is put it right away in a hardener solution.

dr

-- drwood (drwood@drwood.com), April 20, 1999.

Thanks to everyone who contributed a response. Here's my best guess at what happened. I'm pretty sure it wasn't bad developer. I processed 4 more rolls of TMX, and 2 rolls of Tri-X last night from the same stock. Everything went extremely well. I didn't use the same stock of fix, but the same brand and dilution. I processed all film at the same temp. as the troubled Tri-X(at 70 degrees). I don't feel as though I got a bad batch of film, as some frames showed no grain reticulation, and others did. I think the problem lied in the rinse. I live in an apartment, and use water from a filtered tap. I usually temper the water a few minutes prior to rinse. While the water was tempered, one of my roommates and possibly a few other tenants flushed the toilet. Thus, the film was probably exposed to very hot water for a minute or so. Guess I'll either have to buy one of those valve-type tempering devices, or put a sign on the John. Thanks again for your help.

-- Paul Klingaman (Paul.Klingaman@seagatesoftware.com), April 20, 1999.

Ahh, yes, hot water would make the film more vulnerable to damage. A hardening fixer might help, but a better idea might be to gradually bring the temperature of the developed and fixed film down to the temperature of the water that comes out of the cold tap, and then just use the cold water to wash.

And I think the best place for a film squegee is the dustbin/trashcan/whatever.

-- Alan Gibson (Alan.Gibson@technologist.com), April 20, 1999.

I recommend that nothing but liquid touch wet film: no squeegee. I do the final rinse in distilled water and photo-flo 3 drops per 8 oz. Don't store diluted photo-flo, it develops scum. For rinse water I fill a large container (1/2 gal) from the faucet, adding hot or cold to adjust the temp. Then I dip out of this to rinse the film. No concerns about the temp varying out of the faucet. Refill the container as necessary.

-- Tim Brown (brownt@ase.com), April 22, 1999.

Paul, some films have a softer emulsion than others.. however the TX seems to be ok. my best guess is that you over washed the film.. YES, OVERWASHED... if you soak the emulsion of any film or paper (plate, etc.) it will swell and soften. i too have noticed that TX is a bit slimy compared to other films, but i love the stuff... it is my favorite conventional film. as far as the squeege comments go... i use a sponge to lightly, and slowly remove the loose water from the film surface, and dry my film without the aid of a wetting agent... the catch is to have cleand wash water, and a clean sponge.. a little extra hardner will help to harden the flim, but not necessary if you are careful. whenever i first hang the film to be sponged, i wipe the top with my finger and thumb( to prevent any running of un wiped water) then wash my hands before touching my clean sponge of the rest of the film. Sean

-- Sean (zbeeblebrox42@yahoo.com), July 12, 1999.