in addition to worrying about other people attacking you for food or other belongings, we may also have to contend with MANY dog packs attacking because of hunger. the cats can catch anything you were planning on hunting. both can spread rabies. worse, with no fear of humans, many dogs may begin to think of us as food especially if they've had to eat off corpses in the city or anywhere with a significant human die-off. i read about this at

-- sarah (qubr@aol.com), August 04, 1999

Answers

Why don't we feed Y2K OK NOW fool to the dogs!

-- smitty (smitty@sandiego.com), August 04, 1999.

Dear Miz Sarah

The word is "deffinately" concerning the danger of feral dog packs..In my off time over the years I have prospected in Arizona, N.Mexico, And Utah. And on two occasions I have been assulted by feral dog packs..The most damgerous combo though is the Coydog. A cross breed between a coyote and a dog. These animals have no fear of man, are the size of a dog. And the have the blood thirsty fieriness of the coyote. In packs or solo they are DANGEROUS..But the half breeds generally run as the leaders of their packs.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Shakey ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

-- Shakey (in_a_bunker@forty.feet), August 05, 1999.

if needed, shoot the dog. but that is one thought that hasn't crossed my mind. not too worried about dogs attacking. martial law? yes. dogs? no.

-- eastern runner (NRA@NRA.NRA), August 05, 1999.

Almost hate to share this. Hope no freaking nuts out there misuse it. For those of you who are ever harassed by feral dog packs if Y2K turns out to be a "tough cookie", this will work: Put out bowls -- or better yet puddles of antifreeze (the kind you winterize your car with). Dogs will "lap it up". It taste sweet to them. Trouble is it eats up their intestines and kills them. Unfortunately, it kills them in a very slow, painfull manner, as they lose all energy. Unlike using poison, you don't need to have any "bait". The antifreeze is both poison and sweet tasting "bait" all in one. Again. I figure most of you are mature adults -- not someone who would inflict a horrible death on an animal for fun or "kicks" -- or just because the neighbors dog pisses you off. This is for "extreme crises situations only". Better than shooting. Too many might get away, you waste ammo, and you make too much noise, and you waste time "hunting".

-- Louis (StLouisLouis@Yahoo.com), August 05, 1999.

is it too late to clarify my mention of martial law before i get jumped on? i can see it as a possibility, but am not expecting this. even if it were to happen, what could the military do in 5 monthes with no power grid? my biggest concern.

-- eastern runner (no@no.no), August 05, 1999.

Bars of Baker's Baking Chocolate will do the same thing. If famine becomes a problem you won't have to worry about feral dogs and cats. All wildlife will virtually be stamped out too.

-- dogandkittystew.com (dogandkittystew@dogandkittystew.com), August 05, 1999.

Here in the city where I live the other day, I was out back in the yard cutting the grass (with push mower), when a thin-looking black lab came up the driveway looking for food.

It had no collar, but did have that crazy sort of look that I first read about in To Kill a Mockingbird. I went back into the house instead of messing with it. In the future, post rollover, and post strict law enforcement, I would shoot it to prevent harm to others who may not have a clue.

-- nothere nothere (notherethere@hotmail.com), August 05, 1999.

Think of them as exotic y2k Oriental recipes. Use curry on that cur, fennel for the kennel, kitty fritters. Chihuahua chili. Shepherd Pie. Got rats? Rice-a-Rodent. Hamster Helper.

-- Forrest Covington (theforrest@mindspring.com), August 05, 1999.

Forrest...

Probably has the right idea.. :) many Asian countries consider dog meat a treat...

I used to live in Stockton, CA, shortly after Viet Nam, and many Vietnamese and Cambodians immigrants settled into that region for some reason. The stray dogs disappeared real quick... it's when a few pets also wound up on the barb-y that people started getting upset...

And it wasn't because they were hungry, they considered a fat pooch a delicacy... sort of a filet fido...

Keep them out of the chicken coup, and just in case, look up a few recipies for roast dog...

:)

-- Carl (clilly@goentre.com), August 05, 1999.

Louis: After the dogs/cats die from the antifreeze are they edible (non-poisonous to the eater)?

-- A (A@AisA.com), August 05, 1999.

Reminds me of joke and/or urban legend:

U.S. businessman going to S.E. Asia hears that gift giving lubricates the wheels of commerce, and also that S.E. Asians like cats (dogs?). But he didn't hear about in what manner, assuming for pets. So he buys a very expensive pedigreed critter and presents it to his host.

A few days later, the U.S. businessman again meets with his S.E. Asian counterpart and asks how he liked the gift. "Delicious, thank you so much!"

-- A (A@AisA.com), August 05, 1999.

There will be alot of 'drops' out into the country of dogs whose owners can not feed their kids well. I'm most concerned about the big ones; Akita, Dobbie, Mastif, Rottie, etc. So I now have a deer rifle as well as a smaller rifle for small game. If you plan on raising domestic animals such as chickens, rabbits, etc then I'd say a rifle is 'du rigur'. Otherwise you will lose your flock/herd.

If you live out in the country you may need to give rights to your neighbors to shoot these critters if they are on your property yet you are not at home.

Recently lost 1/3rd of our chickens to a pair of Rottwilers (sic). The police came and could not get the dogs away except by chasing them with the patrol cars. Eventually got them away from the chickens but they wandered over to the goats. Officer put a load of buckshot just in front of them and they hardly flinched. All the while menacing the officers, attacking their cars, etc.

All I can say is that the next time they or any other dog comes on my property and ever so much as snarles at me or glances longingly at my animals will be shot on sight, period, end of report.

-- ..- (dit@dot.dash), August 05, 1999.

sounds fair enough to me,if things get bad and dogs are trying to eat people,people will be trying to eat dogs.

-- zoobie (zoobiezoob@yahoo.com), August 05, 1999.

Urban deer!

-- Bill (y2khippo@yahoo.com), August 05, 1999.

Feral pets are a real danger. Most people won't be able to shoot the pet they can't feed, so they'll turn it out. Or the pet will just go looking on its own for food. I've hunted wild packs, they are nothing to sneeze at.

Chocolate? Please tell me more, this is a news flash to me.

What were those cops doing, firing warning shots? Why didn't they just kill the dogs? Sounds nuts to me.

-- bw (home@puget.sound), August 05, 1999.

Dear A,

I don't know. I will offer a couple of thoughts. First, the process is quite slow. It takes a few days. I'm thinking, with a pack of feral dogs "roaming", that the deceased ones would be hard to find. Probably crawl off somewhere to die. Or be eaten by the remaining pack. What would make this so effective is that you could pour out a large puddle, the whole pack would "lap it up" at the same time; and the antifreeze would not FREEZE since it's winter! It only takes a small amount to kill a dog. That's why it's so important not to leave any spilled antifreeze around for one's pet to lap up. The neighbor's dog died this way. It was VERY distressing to that family. They watched their beloved pet weaken so much it couldn't hold its head up. Then the poor dog died. An autopsy by the vet figured out what the cause was. Again, for anyone reading this, this is ONLY for EXTREME situations!! I hope to God no one misuses this information.

My thoughts on the meat, for those inclined, are two fold -- but again, I don't know; this is only a guess. The damage is done to the animals intestinal tract as I understand it. At first glance, it seems the meat would be good. However, I'm thinking that since the poor animal would be in such dire distress for several days, lots of "stuff" would be dumpted into the dogs tissues by its body. Add to this God only knows what kind of parasites the dog would have picked up, and I think I would pass, if at all possible! Of course, if it's eat or starve, make mine well done, please!

Hope this helps, A

-- Louis (StLouisLouis@Yahoo.com), August 05, 1999.

A 230 grain slug from my .45 is a lot more humane than poisoning the beasts, IMHO. Besides, they might be relatives...; )

gettin my back up...

The Dog

-- Dog (Desert Dog@-sand.com), August 05, 1999.

Chocolate can be extremely toxic to dogs. Had one go beserk with one bite, frenetic; like Speed and LSD the vet said. Scary to watch.

-- pooch frenzy (no choco@our.house), August 05, 1999.

The deal with chocolate is that it will kill if over 6-8 oz. is consumed, based on the weight of the dog. Hell, I'd rather waste a bullet, than 1/2 lb. of chocolate... IMHO.

chocoholic dog... sorta like lionfish... get it???

livin' on the edge....

The Dog

-- Dog (Desert Dog@-sand.com), August 05, 1999.

Louis -- your suspicions about the edibility coincide with my suspicions. I guess we should throw out the "road kill" recipe books. So we get to eat only apparently healthy ones we've shot.

Re chocolate -- something about dogs' chemistry -- any kind of chocolate can poison them. Maybe baker's chocolate is more effective because it hasn't already been "cut" with sugar and whatever else used to make the sweet chocolate in candy. But wouldn't that be a waste of chocolate?

Others: Cats in cities have also died licking antifreeze puddled under cars simply boiled out on hot days (due to coolant recovery tank or radiator cap not working right, or just leaks, I guess.)

-- A (A@AisA.com), August 05, 1999.

We left our dog-pound-special (35lbs) with my in-laws. They left her alone with two pounds of fudge. She at it no problem, and my in-laws sat up all night waiting for her to explode. The dog never had a bit of distress.

That's why I was interested in the chocolate. Doesn't sound like a sure bet for pest control.

The dog went and died on me (about 5 years later) so it's not a burning issue any more ...

-- bw (home@puget.sound), August 05, 1999.

I've heard dog's hearts can't metabolize the caffeine in chocolate. It kills them via heart attack. MAybe the fudge didn't have any. I really don't like this thread's topic. I love dogs. I would hate to have to kill one. But a pack of feral dogs is a MENACE. In some areas, they are even the main non-human threat to wolves being re-introduced to the area (saw a good documentary on this).

Mr. Dog, I agree that a bullet is much more humane. Different tools for different situations. a FEW, OK. What about a PACK -- say a dozen or more. You want to get 'em all -- but they won't hold still for your sight "picture" -- not even for your "tella-photo" lens...I mean scope! Plus, if they come "hunting" at dark, the antifreeze will work...while you sleep. Doesn't require gunshot noise. Doesn't piss off people who might "report you" for shooting those "poor puppies".

You get the drift. I hate feeling like I'm defending an inhumane method. I'm just pointing out the specifics of a "tool" for taking care of the problem I'm aware of. I think if those reading this would just think about the anticipated scenarios they envision, the correct "tool" for the job will become evident to you. Again, I sure hope nobody misuses this information. I also hope nobody ever has reason to use it! Getting attacked by several big, mean dogs who come upon you VERY QUICKLY -- or worse upon your kid or "significant other" will give you enough bad memories to keep you in "stiches" (that's the medical kind) for a lifetime. Rabies shots at the local FEMA shelter anyone?

Please be as kind to animals as possible. Thank you.

-- Louis (StLouisLouis@Yahoo.com), August 05, 1999.

Don't forget about disposing of your trash appropriately so as not to attract feral 'pets'. A perfect example is the a??hole who lives nextdoor. His pit-bull gets out of the fence regularly and the first place it goes is to my trashcan, since the thing is half-starved by it's a??hole owner. I assume that it's hunger is what makes it stand up to my two pit-bull half-breeds when they 'manage' to get out of my fence to go after it. If it is willing to fight with bad odds to get a scrap of garbage, I can just imagine what a whole pack would be willing to do. Don'd just rely on your own guard animals to scare them off. The funny thing is though, my pommeranian got out once and went right after that damn dog, and I kid you not, she bit it on the ass and it turned tail and ran straight home! One of the funniest things I've ever seen. I'm just glad it didn't figure out that the whole front half of her would fit conveniently in it's jaws! 8-()

-- claude (cjwarner@yahoo.com), August 06, 1999.

and always clean all game on the trap line,not in camp.that way game is attracted to the trapline where it belongs.

-- zoobie (zoobiezoob@yahoo.com), August 26, 1999.