So our military gets innoculations against Anthrax in case of terrorism. What can WE (US citizens) take to survive the disease???

-- Mo questions (Maureenls@Worldnet.att.net), August 11, 1999

Answers

MO:

In reality not a whole lot. It is not something made-up by technicans developing biological weapons. It is naturally wide-spread. Unless you have lived in a sealed apartment in NYC, you have probably been exposed. The reason for treatment of troops is different. But in reality, biological weapons are really not efficient. There are a lot of things to worry about that you can address. I would forget this one.

Best wishes

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), August 11, 1999.

FYI, according to the Merck's Manual, 16th edition (if you do not have a copy, go to amazon.com and get one NOW!):

"Treatment for cutaneous anthrax is procaine penicillin G 600,000 u intramuscular twice a day for seven days. Tetracycline 2 gms/day in 4 divided doses orally (for children 20 mg/ke/day in 4 doses) is also effective. Erthromycin may be used alternatively" (for those allergic to penicillin).

For pulmonary anthrax (the airborne kind that is favored by terrorists), "early and continuous IV therapy with penicillin G 20 million u/day." "If treatment is delayed, death is likely" (pp102).

Vaccines are available, and "recommended for those at high risk (veterinarians, lab techs, employees of textile mills processing imported goat hair)."

Unless you are raising cattle, sheep, or goats near the Mexican border, you probably have never been exposed to nor seen a case of anthrax (aka "hoof and mouth" disease).

BUT!!! In the event of social breakdown, you are MUCH MORE LIKELY to see cases of debilitating diarrhea, especially in the young and elderly, leading to death by dehydration.....

Plan appropriately!

Anita Evangelista

-- Anita Evangelista (ale@townsqr.com), August 11, 1999.

Anita:

"Unless you are raising cattle, sheep, or goats near the Mexican border, you probably have never been exposed to nor seen a case of anthrax (aka "hoof and mouth" disease)."

While I respect your previous posts, I would like to see references to the peer reviewed literature that support this view. Exposed to and have seen a case of are entirely different cases. I know the index well and know what it means. You know I consider these things for a living. Being exposed to it doesn't mean what you seem to think it means.

Best wish

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), August 11, 1999.

Just for the record:

Anthrax (bacterial) is not hoof and mouth disease (viral)

While one could expect the occasional Texas cow shuffling around in the dust to pick up enough Anthrax spores to become infected, Hoof and Mouth disease has not been reported in this country in many, many moons.

-- beth (bethkl19@idt.net), August 12, 1999.

Z1X4Y7:

You said:"While I respect your previous posts, I would like to see references to the peer reviewed literature that support this view."....

You are welcome to do a search. You have a computer, don't you?

You also said: "Exposed to and have seen a case of are entirely different cases. I know the index well and know what it means."

Duh. Do you know what the word "nor" means? As in "exposed to NOR seen a case"?

Beth: "Hoof and mouth" is folk terminology for a number of ailments of cattle and sheep, most common being anthrax. I have heard it used also in sheep owners to designate another infectious condition also called "sore mouth" or "orf". Sore mouth is seldom fatal, but can cause feeding problems, weight loss in lambs, and udder infections (plus, it is transmittable to man). Sore mouth is caused by a poxvirus -- perhaps this is what you are refering to?

Anita Evangelista

-- Anita Evangelista (ale@townsqr.com), August 12, 1999.

No, I was referring specifically to Hoof and Mouth/Foot and Mouth disease, a viral vesicular disease of cloven-hoofed animals that is enzootic in many areas of the world, but not here. Our government "treats" outbreaks of this disease with total depopulation of the farm, which is why an outbreak is dreaded and monitored for closely. Caused by a picornavirus (I think that's right--not a pox virus at any rate)

Vaccination, used in many parts of the world, is not 100% effective.

I agree, the term "hoof and mouth" gets used colloquially and non-specifically for a lot of conditions, although I can't recall ever hearing Anthrax called that. There's not much about a fulminating case of anthrax that referable specifically to the mouth or foot. Anyway, it's confusing, since there is an actual "hoof and mouth disease". It makes epidemiologists hearts go pittypat when they hear it used.

-- Beth (bethkl19@idt.net), August 13, 1999.

Hi Beth:

Think I've found what you are referring to: Aphthous fever, aka Aftosa aka Epizootic aphthae aka hoof-and-mouth (alternately, foot-and-mouth disease, FMD). Afflicts all cloven-footed critters.

Causal agent is a rhinovirus; rare in Central America, North America, Australia, NZ...endemic in Africa, Asia, South America, parts of Europe.

Appearance of vesicles in mouth, nostrils and on feet and teats, some similarities to other viral vesicular diseases -- which is perhaps where the name confusion with the sheep disease "Sore Mouth" comes from.

In any case, I appreciate the information and will make a point in the future of not associating FMD with Anthrax.

BTW, would you be the "Beth" who posts occasionally to Cory's?

Anita Evangelista

-- Anita Evangelista (ale@townsqr.com), August 13, 1999.

Don't think so. I drop my nuggets in c.s.y2k mainly.

-- beth (bethkl19@idt.net), August 13, 1999.

Anita:

I have 7 computers. But I don't need them. I know the literature very goodly. But then you already know that. Your confusion between common usage and diagnosis is understandable. It happens all of the time. You do a good job here. Keep it up.

-- Z1X4Y7 (Z1X4Y7@aol.com), August 14, 1999.

Just so you'll know, there are a lot of folks in the military who are not exactly jumping for joy at the prospect of anthrax vaccinations. Outright refusals to take the vaccines (many resulting in courts martial) and resignations (among officers) are relatively commonplace and widespread, since there are indications that 1) the vaccines cause a variety of problems and 2) they don't really work all that well anyway. =====================================================================

Marine Jailed for Refusing Anthrax Vaccine Private Cited Drug's Adverse Affects Aug. 13, 1999

CAMP PENDLETON, Calif. (AP) -- A Marine helicopter crew chief has been sentenced to 30 days in confinement and issued a bad conduct discharge for refusing to take the anthrax vaccination required for all military personnel.

Pvt. Eric Myers, 20, of Elbert, Colo., also was ordered to forfeit $400 in pay.

"I stood up for myself and my health," Myers said after Thursday's hearing. "I think that's a right people have, regardless if they are in the military."

All 2.4 million active duty and reserve troops are required to get the anthrax vaccine as protection against biological warfare. The Pentagon says more than 40 people have reported adverse effects to the vaccine, but all have recovered.

Judge rejects safety argument

During the hearing, Myers took the unusual move and entered a conditional guilty plea, allowing his attorneys to appeal a pretrial decision by a military judge who rejected Myers' efforts to argue that the vaccine was unsafe.

If Myers wins the appeal, he can withdraw his guilty plea and be granted a new trial.

Myers' lawyer, Maj. Jeff Nagel, said the pretrial ruling last month gutted the defense.

"We had no defense," Nagel said. "It became a case of explaining that it was a moral conviction [by Myers]."

Can't 'pick and choose our orders'

The prosecutor called Myers' refusal insubordination.

"It's a matter of discipline," Capt. Breven Parsons. "We don't get to pick and choose our orders."

In a related case, the trial of Cpl. Abel Wenning, 22, of Cobb County, Ga., was scheduled to begin today. He also refused to be inoculated.

Myers and Wenning, who is a helicopter airframes mechanic, are both assigned to the 3rd Marine Air Wing.

)Copyright 1999 APB Multimedia Inc. All rights reserved.

-- Lee (lplapin@hotmail.com), August 14, 1999.

Z1X4Y7:

You said:"I have 7 computers. But I don't need them. I know the literature very goodly. But you already know that."

But, when answering the question which opened this thread ('What can WE (US citizens) take to survive the disease???'), you answered: "In reality not a whole lot. It is not something made-up by technicans developing biological weapons. It is naturally wide-spread. Unless you have lived in a sealed apartment in NYC, you have probably been exposed."

For someone who owns 7 computers and who knows the "literature very goodly", you sure answered the question wrong -- so, in fact, I DON'T "already know that".

-- Anita Evangelista (ale@townsqr.com), August 14, 1999.