My brain hurts. Over the past three days, Ive popped in and out of the TB2000 forum and the Debunking Y2k forum, and have witnessed some fairly intense arguments. My question to all of you is this: Have any of you who are arguing the most intensely about the potential impacts of Y2k ever spoken to each other via telephone or face-to-face? Dont worry. Im not going to quote anyone on this thread. Id just like to know. FYI, for those who care (I received 8 emails today in search of the book) the new URL for The TP Chronicles (as someone has nick-named the book, and I certainly dont mind) is:

The TP Chronicles

The book description has changed slightly. It will change again, no doubt. There will also be a new URL in a couple of weeks or so. One can always find the book, however, by searching Amazon.com/Zshops under the name The Toilet Paper Chronicles. Sleep well, and thanks.

-- Marianne Michaels (scipublic@aol.com), October 18, 1999

Answers

Since none of us (except for the very rare insider report) has anything other than public news reports to contribute, why should we bother talking to each other at all?

You could get everything useful in this forum by checking the recent press articles page off De Jager's site (http://www.year2000.co m/y2karticles.html and by reading any of the survival prep sites if you are so inclined. The rest is just a big party where you can comiserate with like-minded blowhards with nothing better to do....

-- You Know... (notme@nothere.junk), October 18, 1999.

Uh,. . . I guess that means "No."

Next?

-- Marianne Michaels (scipublic@aol.com), October 18, 1999.

No.

But while you're waiting for more responses, Marianne, did you see this thread (Beans and air quality)?

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-new-answers.tcl?topic=TimeBomb %202000%20%28Y2000%29

-- Old Git (anon@spamproblems.com), October 18, 1999.

Face to face, telephone, email. Yup, yup, yup...

Even got my name put in a book!

Snip from Charles Perrow's Normal Accidents:

from the Postscript: The Y2K Problem (pg. 395)

(Critt Jarvis, whom I know only from the net, opened up this world for me because of his interest in my book, and he has been indispensable.)

I have a pretty amazing y2k address book. And it still amazes me the consideration busy folks will put into their responses to my requests.

The experience is quite humbling when I get too caught up in forum monologue/mulitilogue., you know?

Critt

-- Critt Jarvis (critt@critt.com), October 18, 1999.

I am Y2K

-- The Cat's Butt (catsbutt@umailme.com), October 18, 1999.

Marianne, I have often wondered if the chicks over at the de-bunking Y2K forum are interested in mudwrestling, but being the shy, reserved type, have never asked. Perhaps you could inquire on my behalf, next convenient opportunity?

-- King of Spain (madrid@aol.cum), October 18, 1999.

Marianne you old tart,

at least you have some style aka MP...

g'luck with the book...

tartette

-- Andy (AUVENGER@cs.com), October 18, 1999.

The people on this forum are amazing! A week or so ago, another author posted about using a few quotes from here, and everybody responded with flames from all orifices, threatening lawsuits, talking real tough! "I own my name and words and I'll defend them with this here 12 gauge, that there doberman, and right 'cher lawyer." (I paraphrase). Now this author is doing something very similar and everybody rolls over to get their belly stroked, just like a bunch of kittens lapping cream ! Must be something about that ulta-feminine name "Marianne".

-- mr x (x@x.x), October 18, 1999.

C'mon, Marianne -- let the end times roll, OK? Ya gotta expect confusion.

The real development here is King of Spain's new approach. Veddy proper indeed.

-- Tom Carey (tomcarey@mindspring.com), October 19, 1999.

You're absolutely correct mr. x, I don't get it either. I guess most of them are still sheeple when it comes down to the real nitty gritty, all talk and no action.

Hey Tom, did she agree to give you a percentage of profits?

-- @ (@@@.@), October 19, 1999.

Mr. x :

FIRST- Ms. Michaels represented herself as an author, in HER OWN NAME WITH VALID E-ADDRESS.

SECOND- She told us EXACTLY what the book would be, and how the quotes would be used.

The "author" you are referring to, who posted from a North Western US University Site, did NONE of these things. Was ANONYMOUS. NO INDICATION of thrust of book, etc., and ASSUMED that the postings here were going to be considered public domain and "fair game", AND iindicated that the handles and e-addresses were the primary point of interest.

Chuck

-- Chuck, a night driver (rienzoo@en.com), October 19, 1999.

And if you don't see the difference then I guess it's one of those "If you asked the question, there is NO answer that you could possibly understand" things like combat or working as a street paramedic.

Chuck

-- Chuck, a night driver (rienzoo@en.com), October 19, 1999.

Chuck,

When did she show you the context in which your quotes would be used? The impression I got is that we are going to be characterized as a bunch of lunatics to be scoffed at, which is exactly what we have despised when this is done by the media and government people.

-- @ (@@@.@), October 19, 1999.

I don't know, King of Spain. I'll think about it. Really I will. But...I may have difficulty duplicating your oh-so-captivating approach. Yes, must think about this.

In the meantime, you may wish to inquire of the techno babes at:

Youll need to scroll down for Brandy, Bambi, Fawn, and Dawn

I dont know whether any of them post over at debunkie, but one never knows...[G]

Old Git,

Yes, yes. I roared the first time I saw it, and have saved it in all of its incarnations since then. (Much funnier than fruitcake lobbing!) I had problems revisiting it through your URL posted above, however. I think this is the correct link.

Beans and air quality--a TB2000 classic

Andy,

LOL! Old? (Whos callin me OLD?) Chuck,

I owe you an email. It shall be forthcoming.

Back to hurtin my brain...

-- Marianne Michaels (scipublic@aol.com), October 19, 1999.

(Much funnier than fruitcake lobbing!)

Marianne, you demonstrate such courage here! ;-) The stealth geese will not be mocked, however,... and getting your name on the FRLian list of potential enemies means you will probably not receive any of the traditional holiday goodies at the appointed time...including the rice and spam on a stick creations famous at FRLian official gatherings.

;-)

-- Donna (moment@pacbell.net), October 19, 1999.

mr x,

Some of us are aware of Marianne's "other" handle here. She's a long time poster, a great researcher and has always behaved as a gracious lady. I would even send her a giftwrapped fruitcake! 'Cept she'd probably use it as a doorstop (a preferred use by some).

The poster you refer to has been an out and out troll... on many occasions. People can often tell the difference... easily.

That said, I'd still prefer to read her book before casting critique.

Diane

These are key threads where she describes the book...

An Author Writes: Have I Described You Correctly? Please Comment. Urgent Book Deadline. (1999-09-28)

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id= 001UJ6

Forum Old Timers: Guess the Caption

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/admin-q-and-a- fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=001UYh

"Toilet Paper Chronicles" Update and Message to Paul Milne: Email me. I need a quote.

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/admin-q-and-a- fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=001Yew

SPEAK NOW,OR FOREVER HOLD YOUR PEACE! OR "PIECE," OR. . .

http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id= 001aff

-- Diane J. Squire (sacredspaces@yahoo.com), October 19, 1999.

Short answer to @'s question is no.

Long answer is I wasn't serious.

-- Tom Carey (tomcarey@mindspring.com), October 19, 1999.

Yes, have met Ed when he spoke here, and I live in close proximity to several who accasionally post here.

Also, I have emailed and been emailed by many over the past year and a half.

-- Sara Nealy (keithn@aloha.net), October 19, 1999.

Diane, at least two of those links throw me to a screen which asks for my admin password.

-- Dancr (addy.available@my.webpage), October 19, 1999.

There have been a few get-togethers, NYC, VA, here on the east coast. I missed the NYC meet, I had my own party to deal with that night. I missed VA, got stuck working. I do wish that I could have made them both... <:)=

-- Sysman (y2kboard@yahoo.com), October 19, 1999.

From the description page for Marianne's book: ISBN No. 0967492718

By Marianne Michaels

Squirrels as terrorists? Exploding caches of beans and rice? Little white wormy things in the freeze-dried "what-the-heck-IS-this-anyway?"

You think youve got problems? Consider what its been like for the Y2k underground.

The road to temporary self sufficiency--or at least to Sams--has been full of pot-holes. The relatives who've ridiculed them for listening to the American Red Cross. The nightmares of spiky-haired ex-yuppies storming their houses. The Y2k Ready (not Y2k compliant, but "Y2k Ready) weasel words from the utility companies. The disconnected messages from government. The fear inspired by alleged programmers who claim to have discovered an additional bug that no one will be able to fix because it will remain hidden until the stroke of midnight on December 31, 1999. The remediation death marches. The schizophrenic stories in the media. The fear merchants selling overpriced survival supplies. The computer experts who claim Y2k is "no problem." The computer experts who claim Y2k will cause HUGE problems. Chinese nuclear weapons commanders claiming systems are ready but still asking something akin to What am Y2k?

Whats a GI (one who gets it) to do?

Answer: Find something funny in all of it or head for a rubber room.

I like "temporary self sufficiency". Sincerely. A good start for so many of the well-washed and fast-food dependent masses. A sense of humor...yep, indeed. Did we not do the Magnificent and Colossal Yourdon Y2K Circus? The Fruitcake Resistance League is an ongoing demonstration of sane people, (ok, mostly sane** ;-) ) at their finest showing Cognitive Dissonance who's the boss. (you may quote me)!

--She in the sheet, upon her hilltop, who knows the motto of the Stealth Geese: We Never Sleep!

-- Donna (moment@pacbell.net), October 19, 1999.

Marianne, I took your question to mean have I ever spoken to anyone I disagree with on the forum. That's a no. But I've met Critt, Puddintame, BigDog and Lee Lapin, and talked to Chuck, Taz and Grey Bear. And had private e-mail conversations with many more.

-- Old Git (anon@spamproblems.com), October 19, 1999.

My brain still hurts

I took a "brain cramp hiatus" this evening however, in order to attend parents' night at school. I arrived to find out that the purpose of the evening was to experience school from my beloved "rug-rat's" perspective, in part by doing said "rug-rat's" work on the classroom computer.

I made an off-hand remark that I had just spent twelve hours on a computer, but what the heck. At that point, one of said "rug-rat's" friends (one of my beloved carpool kids) thought the comment was hysterical. What's even more comical, was that I was serious. Yes, indeedy, I am warped. Such is the life of an author trying fervently to GET THE DARN BOOK OUT THE DOOR!

[RANT MODE OFF]

Now, the only thing I have to worry about in the immediate future is the fact that if one looked hard enough, one might be able to locate Jimmy Hoffa in my office, and I have a television crew scheduled arrive on Friday morning. At least I have clean hair. If push comes to shove, I might be able to make it last until Friday morning.

To quote Greybear, "Got baby powder?" (Guys on the forum, if you don't get it, don't bother. Gals my age remember PSSSST! They know. You don't need to.)

Anyway, back to the original purpose of this thread.

I've laughed at the responses (amid the brain cramps) but the first response was perhaps the most serious to the question.

Here we go:

You Know... (notme@nothere.junk)

Wrote

"Since none of us (except for the very rare insider report) has anything other than public news reports to contribute, why should we bother talking to each other at all?"

Dang, that's a profound comment. Especially because if anyone is going to be "whacked" in this book, it will be government and media, for relying on "the usual sources."

It's late. I am very tired as I write this. However, everyone on this forum should know that I posted the same question to the "Debunky" thread. While no one has posted publicly over there in response to my original post, one individual sent me a private email. I spent about twenty minutes (between getting the "rug-rat" in the shower and saying night-time prayers) responding to same. I think I will receive a response. If not, I'll go back over there to my original thread and bug the bejeebers out of them.

I'm still debating about whether or not to offer "King of Spain's" question, however. I've seen a picture of Cherri and she looks pretty cute in her cockpit photo, but KOS, I'm not sure you're her type.

[Grin]

I'm OUT OF HERE. To sleep, and hopefully sweet dreams. To us all.

P.S. I think I might put a chapter online soon. Only one, however. If I do so, it will be a chapter that has been hashed to death, with no room for revisions. That's already been done. There will be room for commentary, however, and you are most welcome to elevate me to "Goddess" status, should you wish to do so.

Even so, I recognize I may need to stand in line behind Martha Stewart.

The TP Chronicles



-- Marianne Michaels (scipublic@aol.com), October 20, 1999.

Thanks, by the way! Heck I usually sign off that way. Forgot my manners.

Thanks!

-- Marianne Michaels (scipublic@aol.com), October 20, 1999.

Yeah, it don't take much to overwork your brain! If you're trying to sell books you're in the wrong place, we wrote the damn thing, remember?

-- @ (@@@.@), October 20, 1999.

One final post for the night. -- @ (@@@.@) hates me, and probably always will. I shall forgive him however, because not only does he not know of what he speaks, but he appears to have a limited sense of humor. Regardless, my last words to -- @ (@@@.@) this evening are... [Grin], [Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin], [Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin], [Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],[Grin],

And furthermore,

[Grin]

-- Marianne Michaels (scipublic@aol.com), October 20, 1999.

Of course, I would email @ (@@@.@ that message in person, but I can't.

He's anonymous.

Night all.

-- Marianne Michaels (scipublic@aol.com), October 20, 1999.

I spend half my life trying to avoid people like you, why on earth would I want you to e-mail me? Go to bed.

-- @ (@@@.@), October 20, 1999.

At least I have clean hair. Puck the camera crews if they can't take a joke!

Many men will never understand the above life truism about clean hair...and that is perhaps one of the great Y2K levelers! Sleep well, Marianne! (GL...Grinning Largely)

--She in the sheet, upon her hilltop with clean hair.

-- Donna (moment@pacbell.net), October 20, 1999.

At least I have clean hair. Puck the camera crews if they can't take a joke!

Many men will never understand the above life truism about clean hair...and that is perhaps one of the great Y2K levelers! Sleep well, Marianne! (GL...Grinning Largely)

--She in the sheet, upon her hilltop with long, clean hair.

-- Donna (moment@pacbell.net), October 20, 1999.

I did not post that twice.....

-- Donna (moment@pacbell.net), October 20, 1999.

That's O.K., Donna. One for the shampoo. One for the cream rinse. [G]

-- Marianne Michaels (scipublic@aol.com), October 20, 1999.