My daughter is in the military. She leaves a training school Dec 20 and the movers pack their stuff. The plan is currently to go home to grandma's in Indianapolis, and then travel, via Hwy 70, beginning Jan 5th, to the new post in Colorado Springs. There will be two cars, a husband, and a two year old. About 11oo miles. In January.

Given the unknowns of of power, weather, fuel availability, and who knows whatever else, I have been advocating going directly to the new base from the current base in Missouri, so as to be on post, even if in billeting, before the first. Papa wants to go home for Christmas, she is undecided. What say ye?

-- Mary (blufrogg@garlic.com), November 28, 1999

Answers

I've got a similar problem, as one of my sons is supposed to fly back to Chicago on Jan 5th. Aside from choosing the least-risky route back to Chicago, I've got the obvious option of keeping him home with me if it appears that TSHTF before then ... if he gets back to school a couple days late, it's no big deal.

I suspect the consequences are a little more severe in your daughter's case, but it's still worth asking: how much trouble will she be in if she shows up a few days late? Or a week late? Or a month late? I assume that if she phones in to say that she's stranded somewhere, it's not quite as bad as being AWOL, right?

Depending on the kind of car(s) they have, it sounds like 1100 miles is probably about 3 tankfuls of gas. So a key issue is whether gas will still be available on the major interstates in early Jan ... I don't know about you, but I would be putting in a pretty strong argument for traveling in one car if they insist on going home for Xmas.

In any case, maybe you could compromise by agreeing on a backup plan (i.e., going directly to the new base) and some "trigger conditions" that would make it clear to them that they should skip the trip to Indianapolis and implement the backup plan.

For those of us who are parents, this is going to be a rather tense holiday season while we try to maintain a cheerful holiday season while also maintaining appropriate contingency plans.... just in case ...

Good luck to you, your daughter, her husband, and the baby....

Ed

-- Ed Yourdon (ed@yourdon.com), November 28, 1999.

Mary,

They should go directly to the base! There will be (we hope) other Christmases. They should not risk disruptions or the safety of a child. Best wishes!

-- Mara (MaraWayne@aol.com), November 28, 1999.

Meet the kids on base for a 27th Christmas. An option?? Chuck

-- Chuck, a night driver (rienzoo@en.com), November 28, 1999.

---want an alternative opinion? If not, don't read, if offensive, I apologize, it's my honest opinion. Here it is. Encourage your daughter to abandon a military career at this time, if she is legally able to. In my opinion, pretty soon, folks in the military are going to be finding themselves in a lose/lose proposition. They will either have to cooperate in implementing heinous despotic martial law against the US Constitution and against fellow, innocent US citizens, or if they refuse to participate, will be liable for some pretty severe penalities.

At this time, I would recommend no young people enter the service, the leadership today does not have the best interests of the US people as it's primary goal, in fact, it appears to me to be the opposite of that. Then, if she wasn't in the service, you wouldn't have to make that hazardous trip, you could all be safe someplace in the country. In my mind "just following orders" is no excuse for depravity, and it certainly looks as if depraved demons are in charge now. Who would want to "serve" those demons?

I hope you take my post in the spirit in which it was written. If you are on this board, I'm sure you have read many good posts and links indicating the possible scenarios and outcomes of a systemic crash, and martial law is certainly one recurring topic. The government is run by thieves and liars at the top. They have corrupted the armed forces into something that they were never envisioned for, and all suffer because of it. If the situations currently were much different, then different advice would be forthcoming from me, but, the situations are which they are, so, I guess that's that. It would be nice to pretend that everything was "OK", and that it would stay "OK", that our armed forces would be used to defend against foreign aggression, but unfortunately, it looks more and more as if the US through nato or the un or whatever, has become the "aggressor", and it also seems that the president we have now uses the armed forces as his own personal media diverting agents, that is, whenever the president looks like he's getting in hot water here at home he goes and invades or bombs someplace, and it also looks pretty suspiciously as if they are training for US domestic deployment. U-h-h-h, I think this is classified as "not good".

These are my own feelings, and I'm not personally attacking anyone serving, just stating reality as I see it for now. thanks for reading this far, and good luck

zog

-- zog (zzoggy@yahoo.com), November 28, 1999.

I think there are alot of troup movements now. I think the World is like a tight wound rubber band. I don't pretend to know what will come, and I don't believe anything I read either. So I'm gonna duck- and-cover, and hope I can hold out till anything unpleasant blows passed. I just know that if it was my daughter then I wouldn't want her to leave my sight. But if she is late reporting then she will face certain court marshal, and may be incarcerated. If she is concerned about her current position, then she can explore options that won't lead to incarceration, such as transferring. I hear the brig really sucks!

-- Hokie (nn@va.com), November 29, 1999.

2 Answers Mary and Zog

Mary,

I'm in almost the same position (son being reastationed in Jan). Short answer is have them on post before 1 Jan. military is the only organization capable of taking care of its own in a serious situation.

Zog,

I am offended. "They have corrupted the armed forces into something that they were never envisioned for"

BULLS$%T.

The armed forces absolutely are NOT corrupted.

They are the only ones in government putting their lives on the line for the rest of us.

-- ng (cantprovideemail@none.com), November 29, 1999.

--ng---here ya go, an open challenge to you. Please provide the links for all to see that verify that A-the NATO invasion of Yugoslavia was a legal order as per NATO'S own charter. B-That using American forces in the Yugoslavia/Kosovo invasion, a foreign country, was completely legal and justified under the US constitution, i.e. please provide a link to the source where we can all see that CONGRESSIONAL DECLARATION OF WAR. Not an "action" by the executive branch, I want to see where CONGRESS declared war on another nation, and hopefully, maybe you can show me where the Yugoslavians invaded the US someplace? I must have missed that one. Any link will do. You provide those, I'll leave the board. In my mind there's only ONE military hero lately, ONE military man who understands his oath of office and has a working understanding of the US Constitution, and that man is Michael New. For a report of a REAL SOLDIER who had the guts to put his life where his oath was, read this article. There are many, many equally brave and intelligent members of the armed forces, all branches, who are getting out now, because they are basically sick at what's happening in the armed forces. This blind obedience thing is tiring, as is the electronic chest beating. Again, I challenge you, show me where ANY of the actions that the US military has undertaken in the last 2 decades, where life was lost, where agressive military action was taken, where these actions where the tiniest bit legal? Huh? Where? Sorry, I just don't trust our mil anymore, too much kowtowing to illegal orders, too much playing power politics for the internationalists purse strings, NOT the DEFENSE of the US public. So, take my challenge, provide the links, let's see what you have besides zeig heil blind allegiance to-not the CONSTITUTION as you profess-but to some "superior officers" b.s. that was dropped down the chain of political command.

Go for it!

zog the patiently waiting

-- zog (zzoggy@yahoo.com), November 29, 1999.

Hey! - Zog et all - get your own post for this side bar argument. I NEED TO KNOW what the other intelligent folks think about the risks they will be incurring.

They are currently in Missouri. The other gramma is in Indianapolis, I am in California. We are talking an 1100 mile auto trip, in the dead of winter, on I-70, in the face of the risks we may be incurring due to y2k. I was hoping for the opinion of other adults, because, after all, I'm only Mama.

Thank you to those who responded to the post as it was originally presented...so far you are running a "nay" to the post rollover travel.

-- Mary (blufrogg@garlic.com), November 29, 1999.

As a former Missourian, I did a lot of traveling on I-70 and it sucks under normal conditions. I-70 is a major east-west route and is always under construction--traffic is always bad. During a snow or ice storm it can get really nasty, especially through western Kansas and Colorado. Figure in y2k problems and who knows?

My two cents worth: Skip Christmas and see that your daughter gets on base ASAP. Its not worth the risk, especially with a young child along.

-- Sam Mcgee (weissacre@gwtc.net), November 29, 1999.