I am on another e-mail list called RM-Bible list. It is out of Abilene Christian University and mainly consists of a capella folk, but there was a post today from LeRoy Garret that really disturbed me. I'll let you read it and be the judge for yourself. Let me know your thoughts. Sorry for the length:

To my RM-Bible sisters and brothers, greetings!

In response to some concerns expressed on RM-Bible about my essay on Is the Gospel a Quid Pro Quo?, passed along to you by Tom Farr, the following points may serve to clarify my thesis:

1. Certain texts reveal a biblical universalism, i.e. Christ's death on the Cross was for everyone; he saved all people before and after him: Rom. 5:18: As one man's trespass led to the condemnation of all men, so one man's act of righteousness leads to acquital and life for all men. Rom. 11:32: God has assigned all men to disobedience that he might have mercy upon all. 1 Cor. 15:22: As in Adam all die, so in Christ shall all be made alive. Heb. 2:9: So that by the grace of God he might taste of death for every one. 1 Tim. 2:6: Who gave himself a ransom for all.

There are many such texts that make it clear that at the Cross every person was/is saved. Our Lord is not the potential Savior but the Savior, period. John introduced him as the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world. So, if we take these Scriptures for what they say, everyone is saved. But there are other passages that make it clear that some will be lost. I therefore conclude that everyone is saved EXCEPT those that the Bible says will be lost, and the Bible makes it clear whose these are: those who "choose not to have God in their knowledge" (Rom. 1:28), those who reject, disbelieve the gospel once they hear it (Mk. 16:16), and persist in this rejection. It is crucial to distinguish between unbelief and disbelief, even if translations do not always make the distinction. The unbeliever (the one who has never heard the gospel through no fault of his own) is never condemned in Scripture, only the disbeliever, the one who knows God's will but refuses to accept it.

All others are saved as the universalist passages indicate. This makes the gospel really the good news that it is. Is the alternative really good news?: Everyone is lost except those who believe and obey. This leaves great masses of humankind, many who have honest and good hearts and doing the best they know how, lost and hell bound.

2. It is consistent with Scripture to conclude that God reaches out to those beyond the gospel or any revealed law. Note some rather amazing instances.

a. In the judgment scene in Mt. 25 there are those who are invited into the kingdom prepared for them from the foundation of the world for serving Christ when they did not even know they were serving him. It was not what they believed but what they did: clothing the naked, feeding the hungry, etc. They do not know Christ but they are saved.

b. In Rom. 2:14-15 there are those who did not have the law who did the things required by the law by means of the law written in their hearts. Paul appears to give them a place apart from those, whether Jews or Greeks, who rejected the law they had.

c. In Acts 10 Cornelius, a Gentile, is referred to as a good and righteous man, full of prayer and good works. If not "saved" he was certainly "safe." When he received further light, the gospel preached by Peter, he accepted it. But he was "righteous" before he was a Christian.

d. Paul says that as Saul the persecutor of the church, he received mercy "because I did it ignorantly in unbelief" (1 Tim. 1:13). Not disbelief (he never rejected the light), but unbelief (he was ignorant, beyond his ability at that time to know better; he says in Acts 23:1 that he had always lived before God in all good conscience).

e. All the saints of the OT who lived before Christ and the Cross. They had faith in that they had hearts disposed toward God, and that faith was reckoned to them as righteousness, as in case of Abraham. According to the universalist passages Christ died for them too.

f. But not only Jews in OT, some Gentiles also. Mal. 1:11:"From the rising of the sun, even to its going down, My name shall be great among the Gentiles; In every place incense shall be offered in my name." All around the world Gentiles had built altars to the true God of heaven!

g. In Gen. 20 it is evident that Abimelech, a heathen king, communicated with God and found his favor. When he mistakenly took Abraham's wife, the Lord rebuked him, and he quickly corrected it. God referred to Abimelech"s "integrity of heart."

h. So with Rahab the harlot and Job. They are held up as examples of faith in Scripture, but they were pagan or heathen, not covenant people.

3. In regard to specific questions raised:

a. Jerome Barry references Rom. 1:16 and notes that it is only in the gospel that the righteousness of God is revealed and only to those that believe. He understands my position to be that God imputes righteousness apart from faith. This is to misunderstand the nature of faith. There is a faith in Scripture that goes beyond a personal faith in Christ, as the above paragraphs indicate. Abraham, Rahab, Job, Abimelech, Cornelius, etc. all had faith when faith is understood to be a heart disposed toward God. As Acts 14:17 assures us, God never leaves himself without wittness. Every person has some light, however dim. Faith is a response to that light. Justification by faith is the only justification there is, in OT and NT alike. But faith in Christ is not the only faith. The lost are those who reject such light as they have. All others are saved, as the universalist texts affirm.

b. Joe Messick states a concern that always comes up when this thesis is presented: if the masses are saved by Christ's death apart from personal faith in him and are lost only when they reject the gospel, then why risk their rejecting the gospel by taking it to them. We should therefore not evangelize. While I addressed this in my initial article, let me say here that this is to misunderstand the purpose of missions or evangelism. Even if we knew that all the pagans-heathen of the world were saved, we would still want to take the gospel to them, for the gospel has power to do far more than keep people out of hell. Its purpose is fellowship with God and the riches of Christ. God did not send Peter to Cornelius because he was in danger of hell, for he was already a righteous man. It was to provide for him a deeper and richer fellowship with God. This is a basic purpose of all evangelism. Too, the gospel is the greatest of God's light. Those out in our dark world who accept such light as they have will accept more light, the gospel. These are the elect. Those who reject the gospel will be those who have already rejected such light as they have. These are the non-elect. They are lost not because they reject the gospel; they are already lost for rejecting the light they already have. This is the point of Paul's argument in Rom. 1-2. All are under sin. Why? Because they reject either the revealed law (Jews) or the moral law (Gentiles). Except some who do by nature what the law requires even though they have not the (Jewish)law. (2:12-14) No one is ever worse off for having heard the gospel!

c. Scott Wiley thinks if I am right then most everyone will be saved, but Jesus refers to few being saved and a narrow gate. My thesis does not simply anything about how many or how few will eventually be saved in heaven. Only God knows that -- the elect will be saved. My thesis does identify the elect: All are of the elect except those that reject (and continue to reject to the end) such light as God has given them. But no one knows how many these will be. The Scriptures seem to imply that the majority of humankind will be lost. But this will not be because Christ did not save them. He has saved everyone! The universalist verses confirm this -- EXCEPT those that reject the salvation by rejecting whatever measure of light God has given. But we don't know how many this will be. The book of Revelation pictures multitudes being saved, more than man can number. But one thing is certain. There will be multitudes in heaven who never had a personal faith in Christ upon earth, who never even knew of him! Count them: all the infants and incompetent, all the OT saints, all the pagans-heathen (like those named above) who had a heart toward God and always did all they knew to do.

In conclusion, I might add that this thesis is not unique with me but has been argued by some of the brightest, pious scholars in the history of the church, including our own Alexander Campbell. I was led to these conclusions long years ago in part in reading the old Scottish theologian so admired by Campbell, the great James MacKnight, whose translation of the NT Campbell used in his Living Oracles. Perhaps a quotation from MacKnight's Apostolic Epistles would be appropriate for a conclusion: "The gospel does not make it necessary to salvation, that men have an explicit knowledge of Christ, and a direct faith in him, if they never have an opportunity of knowing and believing on him. On the contrary, by informing us, that all mankind live at present, and shall hereafter be raised from the dead, through the obedience of Christ, although the greatest part of them know nothing of him, nor of his obedience, the sacred oracles lead us to conclude that at the general judgment many shall be saved through Christ who till then never heard of him. Besides, is it not as agreeable to justice and goodness to save the pious heathens through Christ, notwithstanding they never heard of him, as it was to condemn all mankind to death, for the sin of Adam, although the greatest part of them never heard of his disobedience?"

Soldier on!, Leroy Garrett

-- Anonymous, January 14, 2000

Answers

Michael....

For one thing.....talk about a jump of logic that because someone Campbell admired believed in universalism....therefore....so did Campbell....is equivalent to saying that Campbell was an athiest....because he admired and was good friends with Robert Owen.

Really....coming form Garrett....those of who in the know when we studied at Florida Christian College under Roger Chambers were already well aware of Garrett's liberal leanings.

In fact, his book is the book I alluded to in the "Is the RM Still Valid for Today" thread. Garrett all but suggests in his textbook that the RM was a mistake that should have never happened.

You are right to be bothered my this quotation from him.

-- Anonymous, January 14, 2000

It is amazing to me (well maybe not soo amazing) that a man such as Garret would totally go off the wagon. If Garrett is right then a tribesman in Africa is saved due to his obediance to the moral laws that he is raised with. As I took the article, the African once he knows about Christ and rejects him then is damned for Hell. But, until then his ignorance will save him. But, this certainly goes against scriptural teaching. How is he able to still teach? If he does where? Such personal theology would certainly get him fired from Johnson Bible College or Florida Christian College. Personally, Garrett either fell off his roof and suffered brian damage or is definately deceived by the evil one.

-- Anonymous, January 15, 2000

Brother Demastus:

I am very happy to notice your concern over the false teaching of Brother Garrett. It is regrettable that one with such talent, knowledge, and ability to express himself should have so severely deluded himself as to take these erroneous positions and use his superior talents to lead others astray from the truth.

It is for this reason that I have determined to give evidence from the word of God that is contrary to his conclusions. Then, in a separate post following this one, to examine, in the light of Gods eternal word, the things that he has affirmed in this article that you have quoted in the hope that it may influence others to turn away from his false teaching. I will first give evidence from the scriptures that salvation comes through Christ only in obedience to the gospel. Then I will examine in some detail each argument made by Brother Garrett. After which I will summarize my remarks in a third post with a discussion of other verses that have indirect bearing on this momentous theme. It is my hope that it will be helpful to you and others who must unfortunately face the errors that he is propagating in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.

It is not new that someone should seek to find salvation for those who have never heard the blessed gospel of Christ. We would all hope that those whom we consider to be good men that have never had the opportunity to hear of Christ might obtain mercy from a just and righteous God. That God may do so is his business. And I want to be clear that should he arrange for their salvation apart from hearing and obeying the gospel that I would be the very first to thank him. However, this hope has not been given to us in the pages of Holy Writ. For we are clearly told that the gospel is the power of God unto salvation to the Jew first and also to the Greek. Romans 1:16. We are also told that Christ is returning to take vengeance on those that, know not God and obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of God and the glory of His power. 2 Thess. 1:7-11.

Then there are the clear words of the Apostle Paul when he wrote, For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher? And how shall they preach, except they be sent? As it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things! But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report? So then faith [cometh] by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. But I say, have they not heard? Yes verily, their sound went into all the earth, and their words unto the ends of the world. But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by [them that are] no people, [and] by a foolish nation I will anger you. But Esaias is very bold, and saith, I was found of them that sought me not; I was made manifest unto them that asked not after me. But to Israel he saith, All day long I have stretched forth my hands unto a disobedient and gainsaying people. (Romans 10:13-21). Now notice that Paul, who was inspired of the Holy Spirit, did not have the brilliant insight that those who have never heard of Christ could be saved as has been recently discovered by our own brilliant and talented Brother Garrett. Look at the words of the Apostle to the GENTILES! He said by inspiration,  For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. Brother Garrett has discovered that everyone is going to be saved, though he qualifies it, so long as they live in harmony with whatever light they have no matter how dim. But Paul is clear, whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. I do not have to tell you that I would believe the Apostle Paul was correct. He then ask an important question, How shall they call on him in who the have not believed? Now these would fit Brother Garretts disbeliveers as opposed to his unbelievers. For these people described by Paul are not those who have rejected Christ but are rather those who have not believed. As is clear from Pauls words as they continue,  And how shall they believe on Him of whom they have not HEARD? Now these people are clearly described as those who HAVE NOT HEARD. SO Pauls argument runs thus whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved. But who will be able to call on the name of the Lord? How shall they call on him if they do not believe? Then how shall they believe if they have not heard? Then, how shall they hear without a preacher? And how shall the y preach except they be sent? This is very different from our Brother Garrett who has discovered that Christ saved everyone when he died on the Cross. But he excludes those who reject whatever light they have. By doing this he is in the ridiculous position of being a non-universal Universalist Then he decides that the only reason to preach the gospel is to help everyone enjoy the riches of Christ. He says they are saved without calling on the name of the Lord and that they cannot be called unbelievers because they have never heard of Christ. But he imagines that they can be called disbeliveers but that no one will be lost for not hearing of Christ. But Paul says the opposite. Paul says that faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the word of God. Without HEARING the word of God no one can have faith. We are saved by Grace through Faith (Eph. 2: 8). If I cannot have faith I cannot be saved but I cannot have faith without hearing the word of God. As Paul says none can hear without a preacher and that there will not be any preachers unless they be sent. So Pauls reason for preaching the gospel is because it will save those who are lost. Hear Pauls inspired word in 1 Corinthians 1:18, For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent. Where [is] the wise? where [is] the scribe? where [is] the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom: But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God. Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men. It pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe but it does not please Brother Garrett. Brother Garrett just does not think that such is enough. He is distressed that this will leave no hope for his good men who have never heard the gospel of Christ. He has decided that such a process is unbecoming of God to not save all men and then preach the gospel as if it were some decoration that makes the cake much nicer and more enjoyable. He fails to realize that salvation is in Christ and the gospel is the means whereby we call upon Him.

Let us read what the word of God has to say about the relationship the Gospel sustains to salvation of the souls of men.

For though ye have ten thousand instructers in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel. 1 Cor. 4:15

For though I preach the gospel, I have nothing to glory of: for necessity is laid upon me; yea, woe is unto me, if I preach not the gospel! (1Cor.9:16)

Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; by which also ye are saved. 1Cor 5:1-4

But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: (2 Cor. 4:3). Is it not reasonable that if the gospel is hid to them that are lost that those who cannot find it are therefore lost? But Brother Garrett wants us to believe that the gospel is also hid to some that are saved!

But though we or an Angel from heaven preach any other gospel than that which ye received let him be anathema. (Gal. 1:8,9). If we all saved already, without hearing and obeying the gospel, why would it be such a serious sin for another gospel to be preached? In fact if these men are preaching another gospel because that is the only dim light that they have as Brother Garrett would say, how could Paul say that they should be anathema? Clearly those who preach another gospel are accursed. What does this do to the so- called Universalist" passages?

In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them, which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. (2Cor. 4:4). Now Brother Garrett would ask Paul in this place, what are you worried about Paul? Christ already saves these men so long as they live according to the light that they have no matter how dim it may be.

And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying in thee shall all nations be blessed. ( Gal 3:8). Brother Garrett would have us believe that Abraham never had the gospel preached unto him. He would have us to believe that having a heart for God saved Abraham. But here we are told that the scriptures saw beforehand that God would justify the heathen through faith and that the gospel was preached unto him. This eliminates Abraham from Brother Garretts list of those who were saved without having the gospel preached unto them. Now doesnt it?

In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise, (Eph. 1:13) Here the Gospel is called the gospel of our salvation. Brother Garrett would have us to believe that the gospel is nothing more that an announcement that we have already been saved by Christ death on the cross. But if you read the rest of this verse you see that it is after we believe that we are sealed with the Holy Spirit.

 Though he were a son yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; and being made perfect he became the author of eternal salvation to ALL THEM THAT OBEY HIM. (Heb. 5:8,9). This passage makes it clear that Christ is the author of eternal salvation to all those that OBEY him. But Brother Garrett would like for us to believe that the is the author of eternal salvation to all who have a heart for God and are following whatever light that they have no matter how dim.

That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel: (Eph. 3:6) Here Paul tells us that the Gentiles are of the same body and partakers of his promise in Christ and that this is done by the gospel.

For the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, whereof ye heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel; (Col. 1:5)

If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;  (Col.1: 23) Paul says that the Gospel had been preached to every creature under heaven. Now Brother Garrett seems to think that this is impossible. He seems to go on the assumption that the gospel cannot be brought to everyone and therefore it is unfair for those who do not hear it to be lost. The problem is that they are not lost because they have not heard the gospel, rather they are lost because they have sinned against God. Romans 3:23,  For ALL have sinned and come short of the glory of God. So where are these good men who have a heart for God that he is talking about? God tells us, What then? Are we better [than they]? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin; As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God. They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one. Their throat [is] an open sepulchre; with their tongues they have used deceit; the poison of asps [is] under their lips: Whose mouth [is] full of cursing and bitterness: Their feet [are] swift to shed blood: Destruction and misery [are] in their ways: And the way of peace have they not known: There is no fear of God before their eyes. Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God. Where can we find anyone in this world that is not guilty before God? SO where are the good men who have not obeyed the gospel and are saved by following their dim lights? Where is anyone that has followed completely his light no matter how dim? There are none! NONE! We are therefore lost because we are in sin not because we have not heard of the gospel that is designed to save us from sin. If a man were to fall from his boat into deep turbulent water and drown within reach of a life- ring that was cast to him but he did not see it could we conclude that he lost because he did not see the life-ring? Or would it not be true that he was lost because he fell into turbulent water?

Whereunto he called you by our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. (2Thess. 2:14). We are called by the gospel. Brother Garrett has us being called with very dim lights.

But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Saviour Jesus Christ, who hath abolished death, and hath brought life and immortality to light through the gospel: (2Tim.1: 10). Christ abolished death and brought life and immortality to light by the gospel. Then where is there any hope for anyone who has not heard and obey that Gospel.

For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it. (Heb. 4:2).

For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God? (1Peter4: 17). Peter asked a rhetorical question, which by the way in which it is asked carries its own answer. Brother Garrett wants us to believe that the answer to this question is that the end of those who do not even hear of and therefore cannot obey the gospel of Christ is salvation. But in 2 Thess. 1:9-11 the inspired apostle Paul answers this question correctly when he tells us that their end shall be everlasting punishment from the presence of God and the glory of his power. Who are we to believe? You know that we must continue in the Apostles doctrine and fellowship and breaking of bread and prayers. (Acts2: 42). So I will follow the inspired Apostle Paul instead of the brilliant and talented Brother Garrett.

Let us not forget that there is found in the book of Revelation an angel flying in the mist of heaven having the everlasting gospel to preach to them that dwell on the earth. And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,(Rev. 14:6). Let us therefore know that he is not flying around seeking whom he may destroy but rather he is looking for those who he may convince to obey it so that they can be saved. Knowing that they need this gospel because they are lost not just to help them to enjoy the fellowship of God and the riches of Christ. Rather he is delivering the power of God unto salvation!

I pray that Brother Garretts false teaching will deceive no one. It may sound good on the surface but it is extremely destructive and deceptive. I pray fervently that his deceptions will cease. For many are lost in their sins and we must know that the Gospel must be brought to them that they might be saved. (Romans 1:16; 2 Thes. 1:7- 11).

In my next post in this thread I will examine in detail the arguments made by Brother Garrett in this article quoted by Brother Demastus. His arguments deceptively leave out much of what the word of God has to say about this subject and he also has affirmed things without scriptural support that are, in fact, contrary to the teaching of the inspired word of God.

Your Brother in Christ,

E. Lee Saffold

-- Anonymous, January 24, 2000