More Gun Restrictions!

greenspun.com : LUSENET : Countryside : One Thread

I just posted this on other forums as well as this one. While the current topic concerns my own state, I believe it's only a matter of time before this sort of thing happens country wide. Hence the reason for my posting this. While I realize this boils down to a politacal thing, and some of you would probably be just as happy if it was not posted, I consider it of paramount importance to the continued freedom of all Americans. I apologize if I offend anyone, but I hope you'll take it to heart as I believe this sort of thing will affect us all if we don't as country vote to end this! ====================================================================== I just got off the phone with my local gun dealer. I'm still looking for a .44 mag. or .45 Colt Ruger single action for carrying in the north country. Well the news isn't good so far as finding what I'm looking for, BUT the news he passed on to me in the conversation is even worse. It seems that the attorney general in MA has, by what ever means, put up restrictions as to what dealers in this state can sell as far as "new" guns are concerned, that do not have certain "so called safety devices" installed on them. Of course all new S&W's can be sold and "some" Sigs as well! Anything manufactured before 98 can be sold, but all others cannot be sold new. Any used guns can be sold without any restrictions on them. Guess it's about time we put all the other political reasons to vote for a candidate aside. As I posted earlier this month about the numbers of voters versus the number of gun owners and what the outcome would be, I would say it's time to really get that word around everywhere or there isn't going to be a constitution period the way things are going! If you don't remember, it simply stated that if all gun owners voted based on the gun issue alone we can win this hands down as 70 million gun owners voting the "right way" will create a landslide victory given the total of 90 million registered voters! I think it's time to do this don't you! Lets put these figures everywhere we can, emails, other forums, and just plain everywhere! This dealer who is a friend of long standing also told me he heard part of a program that was about just how far we should be allowed to go as far as free speech is concerned! I've always said if they get the 2nd. ammendment that the rest will follow! If we don't do it soon, more of the likes of Bill Clinton and Tony Blair and others of that ilk will be flushing what's left of this country down the crapper!! I don't know about the rest of you but I ain't interested in living in the Nazi States of Amerika! Are you??!!

-- Bob Johnson (backwoods_bob_2000@yahoo.com), July 28, 2000

Answers

Bob, I'm with you on this. My question is - what establishes used?

Maybe there's a way to sell "used" guns anyway.

-- Guy Winton III (guyiii@home.com), July 28, 2000.


One of the problems is that there are too many people voting who have absoutely no clue as to what they're voting for. One guy posted earlier here that he didn't know if he could vote for Bush because he had a smirk on his face. Then there are the people who vote just because Gore promises that the government will put a computer in every home at no cost to anyone. They never realize that somebody has to pay for this stuff. I've always said it didn't surprise me that criminals like Clinton and Gore would want to be president. What surprised me is that there are so many people in this country tht are stupid enough to vote for them. Have you ever noticed that after every incident involving a shooting at a school or something like that, politicians always get up on TV and say, "sometimes we've just got to give up a little of our freedoms in order for people to live safer". I say, the hell we do. We should never give up one tiny part of our freedoms. Just think of all the guys who have given their lives so we can have those freedoms.

-- Joe Cole (jcole@apha.com), July 28, 2000.

You go Joe! I agree.

-- Jim (catchthesun@yahoo.com), July 28, 2000.

If you think your government doesn't want to disarm you go here. To keep the peace, keep your piece"..... http://www.njlp.org/html/body_19990919gunbuybacks.html

Now I ask you what is the point of taking guns from someone who won't use them in the first place. Symbolism over substance!

Little Bit Farm

-- Little bit Farm (littlebit@calinet.com), July 28, 2000.


I use this one a lot and I know I've said it here before but we are approaching the day when you have heard everything that I have to say: They will never take my guns in my lifetime, although they may they may severely shorten my life in the attempt ! I was really thinking that they would go after alcohol when they finished with tobacco but I guess it will be firearms first. These are the items that built this country that must be eliminated in order to destroy it.

-- Joel Rosen (Joel681@webtv.net), July 28, 2000.


Looks like only the Libertarians are for folks keeping their guns. Until the Brady Bill surfaced, we could walk into any gun shop, Wal-Mart, K-Mart, etc., show our driver's license, and purchase a gun with no paper work. If a gun was in a holster and in a woman's purse, man's jacket, etc., it was legal. If it wasn't in a holster, it wasn't legal to conceal. Thought that was kinda funny ~ one of my holsters is open on the bottom; don't have to remove the gun to use it!! (Arizona)

I don't know anyone buying in gun shops anymore. People are buying from people. Being forced to make purchases almost like the criminals. I can't get over these buy-back days they're having in the cities ~ offering $50 if you turn in your gun. Yeah, sure! Looks like the government is out for complete control over the good people. Gee, maybe the bad guys will take out the government! THEY certainly aren't gonna give up their weapons!

Since the FBI is now reading our e-mail, they should find this thread interesting!

-- ~Rogo (rogo2020@yahoo.com), July 29, 2000.


== Maybe there's a way to sell "used" guns anyway.==

Don't you have a section in the want ads of your newspapers? We do.

-- ~Rogo (rogo2020@yahoo.com), July 29, 2000.


I fear, those of us with Federal firearms permits will be the first to feel the master's whip. Like a Jew in Germany, we are already tattoo-ed. I might suggest hiding your guns but to what point ? Your either going to fight or you are not going to fight. Like my friend Doreen has said:" It really doesn't matter if I vote anymore " --the outcome of any election was pre-determined several years before it was held. It is quite possible that our role in this generation will be that of Paul Revere's Ride---THE ENEMY IS UPON US ! GET UP AND ARM !

-- Joel Rosen (Joel681@webtv.net), July 29, 2000.

The Constitution Party is for us keeping our guns. Check out their website at www.constitutionparty.com I saw their candidate talking on C-SPAN last night and I'm about convinced to vote third party for the first time.

-- dave (tidman@midiowa.net), July 29, 2000.

Joe Cole: re: "One guy posted earlier here that he didn't know if he could vote for Bush because he had a smirk on his face. "

I am the "guy" (sic) that posted that. You took my comment out of context. I said I was suspicious, because he is always smirking. As a matter of fact, I haven't made up my mind who I am voting for yet. Since my post also mentioned Rocky and Bullwinkle, you probably could have guessed that it was a bit tongue-and-cheek. My real point was that whoever makes the Supreme Court appointments over the next few years of whatever administration takes office "wins", and is the real reason (for me) to vote. It's more a question of party platform than individual presidential candidate. Our freedoms will be very impacted by whichever party controls these appointments. Prayer in school, gun control, abortion, etc., are all issues which have had recent decisions in close Supreme Court voting. The next few years of decisions will create the tone for our country for years beyond terms of office for any one president. Pick the platform, not the candidate....

While there are many Americans who are clueless about voting for President, let me set the record straight...I work my ass off for making the world a better place, both politically and non- politically. I take my voting responsibilities very seriously. Just wanted to clarify. Thank you.

-- sheepish (rborgo@gte.net), July 29, 2000.



The whole reason for "the right to bear arms" is that our forefathers came here to flee opressive governments around Europe! Where, throughout history for centuries, these Gov.'s disarmed the citizens to keep them "in thier place"! Our forefather's could not plan for everything so they made sure we had the ability, through "freedom of speech", the "right to assemble" and the right "to bear arms", in order to stand up against any "future" gov. that may try to opress the people once again.

If every gun in the world were to cease to exist instantly, I would be sure to have a crossbow, a dagger, a proper sword, or whatever else was apropriate to defend myself and family against true opression!

The few guns I own probably won't be much better than a pithfork against "the kings horseman in armour with mighty swords and crossbows", but I have the right to keep my "pitch fork"!!!

-- Novina in ND (lamb@stellarnet.com), July 29, 2000.


Some excellant and thoughtful responses here. Yes they are out to disarm us. I understand many of you/us would like to see some better choices for president. Well it ain't happening. The socialist environment we find ourselve in now didn't develop overnight. It will take some time and determination to reverse the course. Please, EVERYONE VOTE!!! The change has to start somewhere/sometime. The sooner the better. W. Bush is pro gun, & He will have a chance to set some judges on the supreme court. George W. may not be the best...but He's a darn site better than Al Gore if you love freedom. Heck, I like that smirk of his!

-- john in S. IN (chuxorama!@netscape.net), July 29, 2000.

There's a double edged sword between here and another gun thread ~ on one hand, we're saying to vote wisely 'cause our liberty is at stake; on the other hand we're saying that the choice of president has already been made....that casting a ballot is a joke. A lot is gonna depend on who believes what. Due to the gun issue, I do believe that the Libertarian party will make a bigger dent this coming election than ever before ~ if the ballots are counted honestly.

-- ~Rogo (rogo2020@yahoo.com), July 29, 2000.

Rogo, i am the one who keeps saying that with the reason being that for the last major senate and house elections ABC posted the results for all of the elections PRIOR to the polls closing!!!! They were wrong about Schumer in NY and that is all. Everything else tallied up perfectly. Does that not jade one's view of the entire political process?

I do intend to vote even though I honestly don't believe it matters. I will be voting Libertarian as I simply canot cast a vote for someone who doesn't intend to grab the Constitution out of the hands of the lying thieves who have stolen it through legislation.

-- Doreen (livinginskin@yahoo.com), July 29, 2000.


I for one cannot cast my ballot as I have no one to vote for and I believe it encourages criminal behavior. I think somewhere there must be a little room where they bring the elected to say -"OK, you had some pretty good ideas but you can forget those. You led a pretty decent life and have been fairly honest, but that's all over with now. Tommorrow you will begin classes to learn how to be a lying, murdering piece of garbage just like the rest of us. If you have a problem with that than we will send you to Dallas in the fall.

-- Joel Rosen (Joel681@webtv.net), July 29, 2000.


I agree with a lot of what has been posted and amd also want to reply to some of Joel's observations. In regards to the tobacco settlements that was a great deal for our elected (representatives ?) 200 billion dollars coming into various government coffers for them to spend for what they want without having to tax anyone for the money. I think it is just to logical for the govenments (fed, state, local, etc.) to get the guns out of the way because as long as they are in the hands of the citizens they are a cause for concern to the polititions. If we are not armed how are we really going to not go along with what ever the government wants. I am in a strange mood tonight and wonder if rather than a national memorial for the WWII vets we should make sure that every household has at least one gun to ensure that the government does not take away the rights those men and women sacrificed for and died for. As to the govenment doing away with alcohol it just isn't practical. What do I mean how many of our elected officials are lawyers? If they ever lose their job (maybe I should say position) in government they may have to pratice law and those settlements in alcohol cases make many a lawyer rich. Just a thought. Joel I am not sure your room for politicians to be told the way it is really there or not. I know many years ago my grandpa always told me to vote for the incumbent so as not to corupt another honest man. To late at night I guess but love the information and feelings expressed on this forum. gail

-- gail missouri ozarks (gef123@hotmail.com), July 30, 2000.

==W. Bush is pro gun==

Not the way the media is reporting it! Altho I'm sure W. has guns on his ranch. Never saw a ranch without them. Aw heck, whatever they say before an election doesn't count anyway; they go and change things after they're elected. "Read - my - lips"!!!

-- ~Rogo (rogo2020@yahoo.com), July 30, 2000.


Now I must ask all of you a serious question. Does anyone here feel that it actually makes a difference whom they vote for? I cannot agree with people who vote against a candidate, and overall I feel mostly like Joel does; as in, the time for ballots has passed, the time for bullets has come. That is not a threat for those of you who fear guns and enjoy communism, but it is a sentiment. Do you actually believe that your vote matters in elections beyond the county, and low level state scope?

I read an interesting account of a Tennessee militia that found the sherriff in election fraud and stormed the courthouse to seize the ballots and give an honest count. Do we care enough to even consider doing that anymore?

For my part, and why I plan on tossing my vote in the garbage with the Libertarian party, I think hope does spring eternal in those who are damned......$.02.

-- Doreen (livinginskin@yahoo.com), July 30, 2000.


===I gave the following letter to the Concord City Clerk's office today. It will be included in the printed agenda for the next City Council meeting, in early August.

~~ Sam Cohen July 25, 2000

Concord City Council and Mayor 41 Green Street Concord, NH 03301

Ladies and Gentlemen: I understand that a ten-year-old boy has submitted a petition to the city requesting that gun shows be banned from Everett Arena.

In response, I submit that unthinking and misinformed ten-year-old boys are a nuisance, and should themselves be banned. After all, this young fellow has apparently been taught that the proper role of government is to ban things that he doesn't like; I simply ask for the same privilege. I'm sure I could scare up an equal number of signatures on my petition, and of course, they'd be those of registered voters. Incidentally, please include in the ban all adults who think like those ten-year-olds.

Please also have this boy's parents prosecuted for child endangerment. Surely the City Council has read the recent U.S. Department of Justice report that shows how children whose parents introduced them to guns almost never get involved in violent crime, as compared to those whose parents didn't, and this kid's parents must be in the latter camp.

Meanwhile, please inform the police department that if they ever get a 911 call from this family because a predator has invaded their home and is holding a knife to the boy's throat, to be sure to send the kind of police officers who don't have guns, because this family obviously believes that guns don't solve anything. Of course, if the boy and his family prefer not to know that privately-owned guns are used between four and 70 times more often to prevent crime than to perpetrate it, or if they choose to believe that children are more in danger from guns than ever before (the reverse is true), then maybe they should move to a different country.

How about a nice, safe place like England? Whoops, that won't work: after the British government essentially banned guns a few years ago, their violent crime rates have grown higher than ours, and now "hot" burglaries - in which the residents are attacked - are more popular than surreptitious ones, since the criminals no longer have to worry about getting shot.

Or how about Israel? Uh oh, they wouldn't like that either: after Israel had lost a lot of children to terrorist attacks, it armed its teachers and other adults at schools - instantly bringing those attacks down to exactly zero, but of course now there are those nasty, icky guns everywhere. No, I suppose this family would prefer a place where the government has all the guns and lots and lots of police - places like Germany under Hitler or Russia under Stalin.

If they do choose to stay here, educate them about this country's founding principles of individual liberty, personal responsibility, and distrust of government power - or if those concepts are too hard for them to understand, just remind them of the state motto, which some of us take seriously: Live Free or Die.

Sincerely,

Sam Cohen (registered to vote in Ward 5 of the city of Concord)

cc: Editor, Concord Monitor Al Rubega, Esq., Director and Senior Policy Advisor, Gun Owners of New Hampshire Angel Shamaya, Executive Director, KeepAndBearArms.com ===

-- ~Rogo, South Central Texas (rogo2020@yahoo.com), July 30, 2000.


There are several ways to take over a courthouse. Add a thousand signitures to that letter and Rogo just showed us one of them !!!!!

-- Joel Rosen (Joel681@webtv.net), July 30, 2000.

Edward Abbey said "a partriot is someone who is not afraid to fight his government for his country".

-- Joe Cole (jcole@apha.com), July 31, 2000.

That should be "patriot". Sorry.

-- Joe Cole (jcole@apha.com), July 31, 2000.

Yeaaa for Sam Cohen!! From Kathleen in New Hampshire!!

-- Kathleen Sanderson (stonycft@worldpath.net), July 31, 2000.

Sam, that was great! I wonder when the unthinking types are going to start understanding that passing still more laws to control those folks that ignore the ones we already have is just a tiny bit useless. I'm not sure what the solution is, but empty posturing sure hasn't worked.

-- Connie (Connie@lunehaven.com), August 04, 2000.

Rogo, your letter is fantastic! Please, please let us know the response you get and what the end result is!! I think if more people did what you are doing, it would make a difference. At the very least it would force people to "think" rather than simply "feel", and to disagree at least forces them to choose to ignore the facts and justify the reason they are doing so. Thanks! Wendy

-- Wendy@GraceAcres (wjl7@hotmail.com), August 04, 2000.

===Rogo, your letter is fantastic! Please, please let us know the response you get and what the end result is!! I think if more people did what you are doing, it would make a difference.===

Hold on, Wendy. If you'll look again at that letter, you'll see it was written by Sam Cohen. I just forwarded it to this List.

-- ~Rogo (rogo2020@yahoo.com), August 05, 2000.


My mistake! Sorry Rogo, did not pay close enough attention, oops!

-- Wendy@GraceAcres (wjl7@hotmail.com), August 05, 2000.

You stupid guns will kill more and more innocent. I live in germany and we dont have big problems with guns, because there arent many owned here. Restricting guns is helping solving problems.

-- Philip Copony (phlippp@gmx.de), May 10, 2001.

Moderation questions? read the FAQ