Defending the Catholic faith can be difficult at times, particularly when debating those of the Protestant faiths who rely only on “sola scriptura”. I liken it to fighting someone with one hand tied behind your back. The fact that Protestants accept no argument unless it can be found in Holy Scripture, limits the tools with which one can argue all the Truths found in the fullness of the Deposit of the Faith. It is interesting to speculate what sort of debate would materialize if Protestants allowed us to use our heritage, all truths bestowed upon us by God; those same truths they once accepted, not only those written but also those spoken or handed down to us. How rich and more fulfilling their faith would be were able to draw on its full deposit. Sacred Tradition is separate and distinct from Sacred Scripture, however, it compliments and supports the Holy Word. It rounds out our faith as Catholics and makes us whole. In fact, it was Apostolic Tradition that was employed to choose the Canon of Scripture found in the Bible today.

“Do this in memory of me!” Our very Mass is founded on these immortal words Jesus spoke! A lessen as profound as this one could never be lost regardless of whether it was written down or not! Christ promised to remain with us “always, to the close of the age” (Mt. 28:20). He remains in Word, He remains in His Real Presence and He remains in Tradition. Jesus, Himself told His followers, “do as they tell you, not as they do!” Jesus was affirming the method to be employed in teaching all generations, the spoken word. In saying, “I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the scriptures, and that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day in accordance with the scriptures, and that he appeared to Cephas, then to the Twelve. . . (1 Corinthians 15:3-4); it is quite evident that Paul is putting down in writing the Paschal Mystery he learned of, through Oral Tradition.

And what of music and art in the Church? Were not these handed down as part of the Deposit of the Faith? Do Protestants not sing hymns at service? Do some pictures or images not adorn some Protestant churches to enrich the faith, albeit to a lesser degree than Catholic ones? Worshippers were doing this for ages in the Old Testament, long before it was recorded in the New Testament. “Address ... one another in songs and hymns” (Eph. 5:19) “He who sings prays twice!” (Col. 3:16). From the patron saint of this forum, St. James, we are told to “pray over the sick”, (5:14-15) a foundational practice for many Protestant services, particularly evangelical, as well as a foundation for one of our very own Catholic Sacraments.

It is in the communion of the Church, of all of the baptized united, that a Christian appreciates and reaches his full potential as a lover of God, for it is here that he draws from those who have gone before (saints) and the Mother of God, Mary. By their examples we are encouraged and motivated to actualize our full potential as lovers of God. We must hasten to say, at this point, this is not mandatory for salvation, however, but just like tying one’s hand behind his back for battle, so too, do we Christians hamper our spiritual development by not utilizing all the tools God gave us. Christian assembly dates to the beginning of the Apostolic age. When “Acts, Corinthians and Hebrews remind us to “assemble” they are merely formalizing in writing that which had been done for thousands of years.

We are a product of those who have gone before us. The Church, in Her divine wisdom thirsts for knowledge of the early Christians so that current liturgies and practices will reflect as closely as possible, those liturgies and practices employed at the time of Christ. Tradition lives on and is active and alive today, in the Church and only serves to enrich our Christian experience. The Advent Wreath used before Christmas each year is quickly catching on as a reminder of the impending birth of the Messiah, however , it was only begun to be used first, in Scandinavia, in the 1960's. Conversely, yet similarly, the “prayerful intentions of the faithful” now said at Mass have been instituted as a result of information recently discovered showing that the early Church employed this practice at their Eucharistic celebrations. This practice had been dropped for some 1200 years and forgotten, but only recently re-instated upon discovery to enrich the Eucharistic experience.

And how do we teach our children to pray? When they are able to, do we tell them to read the Bible to learn how to pray or do we teach them how to pray by example and repetition? Is this not Oral Tradition? At the Ascension, Jesus commanded His followers to baptize and make disciples, "teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you . . . " (Matthew 28:20). I don’t think He was suggesting they get it all written down and then make everyone read it!

The Holy Word comes from Tradition itself. I have always wondered how those who would support sola scriptura explain how the apostles and other early Christians preserved the Truths for us when they, themselves didn’t have a Bible to read. The New Testament as we know it, had not been written until approximately 100 A.D. The early Christians used “oral” tradition to pass on what Jesus taught them. When they realized that Jesus might not be coming back, in their lifetimes, it was only then they thought it appropriate and beneficial to write down and pass on to the next generation that which Jesus had passed on to them. The New Testament itself, is testimony of a living, spoken Tradition, handed on by God and placed in written form.

One wonders how Luther’s followers allowed him to remove seven books of the Bible to suit his own purposes, (ie. eradication of purgatory, etc.) particularly since these books had been accepted by everyone for fifteen hundred years. If these same followers held so much reverence for God’s Holy Word, where were the objections then? Were these Books no longer “sacred”? Where is it written in Holy Bible that we can begin a new faith, if we don’t like the way our present faith is being taught? Where is there proof in the Bible, and what are the grounds for justification of eliminating or changing God’s Holy Word?

“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.” (John 1:1). Now I am really confused! If God is the “Word” then how could He exist before the Bible was written, for our Protestant friends have told us that “if it is not in Scripture then it is not from God!”

“But there are also many other things which Jesus did; were every one of them to be written, I suppose that the world itself could not contain the books that would be written.” (John 21:25). John is clearly telling us here that what God wants for us and what He has passed on cannot possibly be contained in any one Book!

One only has to take a cursory look at Holy Scripture to see the abundance of references to Holy Tradition that can be found immediately: 1 Corinthians 11:2 “I commend you because you remember me in everything and maintain the traditions even as I have delivered them to you.” 2 Thessalonians 2:15 . . . “stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth, or by letter.” 2 Thessalonians 3:6 . . . “keep away from any brother who is living in idleness and not in accord with the tradition that you received from us.” 1 Corinthians 11:23)... “for I recieved from the Lord, that which I also delivered to you.” 1 Thessalonians 2:13 . . . “when you received the word of God which you heard from us, you accepted it not as the word of men, but as what it really is, the word of God . . .” 2 Timothy 1:13-14 “Follow the pattern of the sound words which you have heard from me . . . guard the truth which has been entrusted to you by the Holy Spirit who dwells within us.” 2 Timothy 2:2 “And what you have heard from me before many witnesses entrust to faithful men who will be able to teach others also.” 1 Corinthians 15:1 . . . the gospel, which you received . . . Galatians 1:9 . . . the gospel . . . which you received. 1 Thessalonians 2:9 . . . we preached to you the gospel of God. Acts 8:14 . . . Samaria had received the word of God . . . 2 Peter 2:21 . . . the holy commandment delivered to them. Jude 3 . . . the faith which was once for all delivered to the saints. 1 Thessalonians 1:5 for our gospel came to you not only in word, but also in power . . . 1 Thessalonians 1:6 . . . you received the word in much affliction . . . 1 Thessalonians 2:2 . . . we had courage in our God to declare to you the gospel of God . . . 1 Thessalonians 2:8 . . . ready to share with you not only the gospel of God but also our own selves . . . 1 Thessalonians 2:9 . . . we preached to you the gospel of God. 1 Thessalonians 4:1 . . . as you learned from us how you ought to live and to please God . . . 2 Thessalonians 1:8 . . . vengeance upon . . . those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. 2 Thessalonians 2:14 To this he called you through our gospel . . . 2 Thessalonians 3:1 . . . pray for us, that the word of the Lord may speed on and triumph . . . 2 Thessalonians 3:6 . . . the tradition that you received from us.

St. James, Mary Our Immaculate Mother, pray for us!

Ed

-- Ed Lauzon (grader@accglobal.net), February 03, 2001

Answers

Another one in Ed's "traditionally" fine manner.
JFG

-- J. F. Gecik (jgecik@desc.dla.mil), February 03, 2001.

Dear John, Ed, all of us:
We have to ''defend'', as Ed says, our Catholic faith. It could be said, protestants ought to ''defend'' their total reliance on the Bible and private interpretation of scripture.

We Catholics shy away from confronting this false belief in the protestant churches; that only the Bible was intended to teach us. Why do we shy away from confronting a false idea? I suppose it's because we have no choice. If we say a word against it, everybody will say we attack the Word of God! It's a ''slippery slope''-- we'll look as if we don't believe the Bible is the Word of God. Therefore, we keep it all untouchable, for appearances' sake!

Even when we try, reasonably to show-- The Catholic Church has given the Bible to Christianity, --we rally arguments from Tradition, from historical sources and from the Bible itself. As if an argument coming from Protestants is some insurmountable challenge.

I'm sorry, but they won't allow an argument. They will always retreat from it, and continue accusing us of ''idolatry'', Mary worship, the ''murder of Christians'' --!

One poor individual was upset because I told him to stick to the truth; his words screamed from the page: ''Are you calling me a liar, Sir?''

No Matt. You are stating a gospel truth, all catholics are guilty as charged! (Wouldn't want to call you a liar; regardless of whatever you concocted about the Church.) So, we slip back into the ''defensive'' posture. Hit me again, Susan; beat me up, Matt Veld, I deserve it. Israel-- Servant of God-- flame me openly in this Catholic forum. You own it now! But, if I say, ''Take it to where the sun never shines!'' OHH! I'm beastly! See, these mean and nasty Catholics? Why can't they play fair?

>>>>>>>><<<<<<<<<<

Reminds me of the Christian who died in a Roman arena. To entertain the Roman masses. He was too big and strong, so they buried him in the sand up to his neck. His head was exposed, in the middle of the Circus Maximus; and out came a hungry lion!

The lion attacked the poor Christian, and the crowd roared! ''Kill him! Kill him, LEO!'' But as our poor Christian struggles, he manages to bite the big lion; and hangs on for dear life from one of its TESTICLES--!

The lion screamed in pain. Then the angry Roman spectators rose to their feet as one, and screamed, ''You mean, filthy Christian! Fight FAIR!!!''

--That is our own predicament, when we argue with some people in here!

-- eugene c. chavez (chavezec@pacbell.net), February 04, 2001.

Touché..... well said Ed

-- David Amell (damell@usa.net), February 04, 2001.

EUGENE: Your answers on the forum are always welcome. I hope you won't feel offended if I make a small correction in your last post. The early Christians were not sacrificed by lions in the Circus Maximus. It was in the Coliseum:

CIRCUS MAXIMUS.

This was the largest race-track in Ancient Rome, dating from the time of King Tarquin, and was rebuilt several times. Opposite, there is a view of the ruins on the slopes of the Palatine Hill.

Enrique

-- Enrique Ortiz (eaortiz@yahoo.com), February 04, 2001.

Thanks, Enrique, --Hey, watch out. You're beginning to sound like the protestants. One little opening, and they're picking it apart! Ha! I've never been to Rome, sorry to say. But the Christians died; just about anywhere in Rome. Our ancestors, some of us. And ancestors of many protestants as well.

Dear Mother Mary, bless us and pray for us! James, Holy Apostle, pray for the work of this forum, and each one of us! Amen.

-- eugene c. chavez (chavezec@pacbell.net), February 04, 2001.

Jmj

Dear Ed,
You entitled this thread, "Tradition, Oral and Written, A Gift from God!" I hope that you won't mind, then, if I quote something brief and simple, something very nice concerning that part of the Sacred Tradition that was written down -- holy Scripture. Some people who are not yet Catholic are unaware of our love for the Bible.

The following is from an Angelus address given by our Holy Father, Pope John Paul II, on July 26, 1997:
"Sacred Scripture is in fact a pure and lasting fount of spiritual life ... It is like thirst-quenching water and food that nourishes the life of believers. I therefore invite everyone to cultivate a more intense and frequent contact with the Word of God, letting its healing and creative power work in us ...
"Learning to read sacred Scripture is fundamental for the believer. It is the first step of a ladder, which continues with meditation and thus real prayer. Prayer based on biblical reading is the principal way of Christian spirituality. Those who can dedicate the necessary time and commitment to it gather abundant fruits.
"... we pray that every Christian, and whoever is in search of the truth, may become a pilgrim of sacred Scripture and may learn to walk nourishing himself every day with the bread of the Word of Life.
"Let us entrust this intention to Mary most holy, who, by accepting the Word of God, became Mother of the Savior."

St. James, pray for us.
O Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to you.
God bless you.
John


-- J. F. Gecik (jgecik@desc.dla.mil), February 04, 2001.

Sorry, eugene, but I don't see in what way I am sounding like the protestants. But you can be certain that I a am not one of them, and, with the grace of God, I will never be.

Thanks to the Lord who gave me, without any merit on my part, the true faith in Jesus Christ, in the only and true Church He founded, with the holy Sacraments and the loving care of our Mother Mary.

Praise be to the Lord forever.

Enrique

-- Enrique Ortiz (eaortiz@yahoo.com), February 05, 2001.

Dear Enrique; The remark was in fun. Surely you can take a joke. ''Circus Maximus'' was a mistake, and you pounced on it like a protestant over a mis-quotation of the Bible.

I like irony if it is harmless. In another post, I accused ChinTai of being, ''Wise like the dove, and ''gentle'' as the serpent.'' My joke went over his head, and he pounced on it, as if I mis-quoted by mistake. It was no mistake! HaHa!

-- eugene c. chavez (chavezec@pacbell.net), February 05, 2001.

Very well, eugene, I understand you perfectly. I can pray with those who pray, I can suffer with those who suffer, I can cry with those who cry....and of course I can laugh with those who laugh. But I could not resist the occasion of giving testimony to my faith.

God bless you, and keep posting. I learn a lot from your posts.

Enrique

-- Enrique Ortiz (eaortiz@yahoo.com), February 06, 2001.