I am curious what other homesteaders consider to be their most productive and worthwhile animals on their farm, given the time, money and emotional investment they have in them? Why? Doesn't necessarily have to be livestock!

-- Sonya (clb@watervalley.net), March 15, 2001

Answers

Bees are the winner hands down. They take little care and reward you handsomely. Their product is easily marketed and enjoyed by nearly everyone. You also can get more than just honey from them...beeswax, pollen, and propolis are also valuable. Honey is a fairly high priced commodity that folks don't mind paying for. Getting $18 a gallon...and even more if you sell in smaller sizes sure is nice. Milk cow is a close second. If you make your own cheese, butter and icecream you save a fortune if you figure your homemade product at retail prices....also you can raise a calf in addition to all this. Chickens would be next. Eggs are of course easily used by anyone and they are extremely versatile. Chickens can be fed a lot of scraps and simply grown, inexpensive feeds. When they are done laying eggs you can have chicken stew.

-- Amanda in MO (aseley@townsqr.com), March 16, 2001.

Does it have to be on a farm? Dogs 1st no close 2nd; for me ducks 2nd, doesn't take many and they are easier than chickens(my opinion) they can eat about anything. Handle being wet/cold better and I think other stress better as well [dog attacts].I've bought chickens 1 time, I've bought ducks 5 times. then cats, then goats for milk, then geese,{or ginnies} depends how bad the ticks etc. are. Then cows for meat, maybe a pig.{I'm not fond of pork} Maybe specialty chickens or other fowl.Then maybe sheep for wool. I really like horses but they would be a luxury. I think Lunatic {my husband} would put horses right after dogs. Rabbits when ever I could get them cheap, like free, for manure.

-- Thumper (slrldr@aol.com), March 16, 2001.

We raise Angora goats, which produce Mohair. The price and care of them is similar to sheep, except they are sheared twice a year. The Mohair sell, in our area, for $1.00 to $1.50 per OZ., yes OZ. We receive approx. 14 to 20 pounds per year per animal. That works out to $224 to $320 per year. Mohair is in demand by handspinners. Most of ours is actually sold to people who have sheep and alpacas(which we also have) owners for blending with there fibers. And there is nothing more fun then goats. Some of the other things mentioned are great and any animal that produces a product you eat is great, Everyone loves to eat, BUT, when you get into food products, you get into lots of regulations and product liability.

-- David in NH (grayfoxfarm@mcttelecom.com), March 16, 2001.

My dogs are my favorite emotionally. They produce things that can't be measured monetarily. Chickens are the best bang for the buck...guineas as well, but they aren't exactly friendly (the guineas). Goats are very productive and very emotionally rewarding as well. Cats are my best mouse trap and also emotionally rewarding, just not quite as much as dogs. So then there are the wild birds and the butterflies and the dragonflies...what a pleasure! I suppose you should clarify if you want an emotional or purely a profit scenario. I'm not too attached to profit, but I don't want anything that is useless on all fronts either.

-- Doreen (animalwaitress@excite.com), March 16, 2001.

For us, I would say chickens, since they take less than 15 minutes total each day to care for. Bees are very low on our list as the prevention of disease and high losses due to same have been costly. Even with treatment I lost the hive again this year. They must be constantly monitored and can be fine one week and gone the next.

-- Anne (HealthyTouch101@wildmail.com), March 16, 2001.

Free range chickens by far if you can avoid emotional attachment! We also have Pyrenees dogs for livestock protection and make more money breeding the dogs (unregistered) than we get from raising the stock.

-- David C (fleece@eritter.net), March 16, 2001.

Has to be my husband, hands down..well worth the time, money and investment over the years! (sorry, couldn't help myself today)....

-- Lesley (martchas@bellsouth.net), March 16, 2001.

Awwww Lesley....how sweet! Wish I could say the same about mine!

-- Amanda in MO (aseley@townsqr.com), March 16, 2001.

Everyone's suggestions made me think even harder. Spose bees would be good, if, as was pointed out, you can keep 'em alive. I like rabbits because you have so many markets, though fur prices are down, but if you like crafts that can be overcome. I've sold mine live for meat (avoiding gov't regs, cause if I butcher them I'm subject to inspection, but if I sell live and offer the service, I'm not), pet stores, people on the street, and butchered some for meat. They breed, well.... like rabbits.

I think, thanks to advice from the fine people here, that I will be getting chickens and 1 or 2 goats. Really don't have the use for all the milk a cow would produce, and don't want that feed bill. I've had chickens before, and worked with goats on a pal's place. They are both great to watch, (and goats are just plain fun all around).

Dogs, if they are trained - my four huge lugs are just that... lugs... but I love 'em anyway!! Cats - the better fed they are the better they are at keeping away the varmints. Really great investment for a homestead - especially with all the grain, etc. around.

Also.... worms. I set mine up under the rabbit cages, eliminating most of the work there... (rabbits seem to release most of what they eat!). Out here, (I could have died!!!) Regular old round worms sell at $1.79 for 12 worms. They reproduce faster than the rabbits, and, of course, if you like fish, there ain't no better bait!! They eat most of what would otherwise go to a garbage man, so with recycling, I am gaining on the idea of stopping garbage service. I only have about 1 small bag per month. I'd advise going to a bait shop to see what they sell, and raising those. Most times, if you have the right soil, you can dig your initial batch, so they are free outside of providing the home for them!!! But.... they don't offer much in the way of food for humans... Hear you can eat them, but I'm not willing..... lol!!

If you live within 5 miles of town, a horse might be a good bet, if its a versatile breed. They can plow, pull, and save on gasoline - but you have to use them for more than just riding to get your money's worth, and they can be a lot of work. If you want a horse, check into the multi=purpose breeds, Fjords, Icelandics, haflingers.. they aren't as showy as some, but just as loveable, less work and more productive.

-- Sue Diederich (willow666@rocketmail.com), March 16, 2001.

For me, #1 is milk goats. You do have a fair amount of time invested though. Well, not a lot of time, but being tied down to regular milking twice a day. But most homesteaders are homebodies anyway. Cows produce too much for most families, and then you either have to find other animals to use the milk or you waste it. Two milk goats, bred to kid at different times of the year, keep you well supplied year round. You can make cheese, yogurt, etc. too, butcher the wether kids for meat for yourself, and sell doe kids to pay for the cost of maintaining the does. Any excess milk goes to the dogs and cats to cut down on petfood. Of course, this is if you have good quality stock. Very heavy milkers seem to have more health problems, and light milkers aren't worth their keep. As for work, 2 does wouldn't take much more than 15 minutes twice a day, to do the basic milking chores. Takes only a few minutes to feed/water, and you can observe them closely while doing chores to make sure they're in peak health. Given enough room, stall cleaning can be kept to once a week. Most time consuming labor is bottle feeding babies, but that's only about 3 months. Feed for goats is minimal if you have goats that are thrifty.

Next best animals have been Muscovy ducks, they raise 2 hatches per year of 10-18 ducklings, and forage from spring through fall for most of their feed. THey also love goat milk! Butcher in fall and only carry a few adults through the winter. I've also had good luck with turkeys and pigs, for being economical. I'd hate to be w/o my chickens for meat/eggs, but I wouldn't consider them the most economical. Just my experiences. BTW, horses are a big love of mine, but unless you have lots of pasture available, they are expensive to maintain. Altho we may be using them for transportation before long if the gas prices keep rising!

-- Lenette (kigervixen@webtv.net), March 16, 2001.

My favorites are the goats. I used to be crazy over dogs and cats, but once I realized that I could have a productive pet that wouldn't bark at night, and that I could either eat or sell the offspring easily, I turned into a goat fanatic! Our goats pay for their feed, IF we can use or sell some or all of the milk. When I get a market worked out for the registered kids, I think it will be more profitable. The problem I've seen, over and over, is that of keeping too many goats, not culling them hard enough, and not keeping registered disease free stock. When there are so many goats that you are throwing the milk away, it's time to get rid of a few. If we could legally sell the milk, the goats would be very profitable.

Ducks and geese, especially the geese, have done well on very little feed. The geese eat grass for the most part, but will decimate the garden if they can get into it. The Khaki Campbell and runner ducks have produced eggs and meat for us. But butchering the ducks is a hassle, and they like to lay their eggs in the pond where it is difficult to retrieve them!

Dogs and cats would be at the bottom of my list. Dogs require extensive training if you want to be happy with them, they can eat scraps but do better with some store bought dogfood,they poop all over the farm, some will bark at night, they can't seem to learn not to walk, lay, dig, and roll in the garden! In return, they warn of visitors (geese and ducks will do this), provide constant companionship (the goats are less stifling), and guard the livestock( if you can trust then not to attack and kill the stock themselves). Cats are a little better, but they also dig all over the garden, leaving surprises for me to discover while planting by hand, and poop in the hay, giving the goats toxioplasmosis and dead kids. Sorry to sound so negative, but can you tell I am really sold on goats!

-- Rebekah (daniel1@itss.net), March 16, 2001.

I think pigs were the best for me. Got three weanlings, put in a pen with automatic feeder I made and fresh water twice a day. That's it. Feed them bread and veggie scraps (no meat, that makes them smell) Within a few months, it's slaughter time. I had meat in the freezer after butchering for free by selling my other two. They are cute when they are young but once they hit 250 pounds, you're ready to get rid of them.

-- Dee (gdgtur@goes.com), March 16, 2001.

My worms of course. Best $10 I ever invested. Those little worm cookies are real "black gold" worth about $5 a pound, which is a big saving on garden fertilizer costs and improvement on plant quality. Castings have paid for the largest "pasture addition" and the processing equipment I have (shredder, grinder and lumber) and other than the improvements, I only actually work the bins about 1 to 2 hrs a week. :>)

-- Jay Blair in N. AL (jayblair678@yahoo.com), March 16, 2001.

I've started (with my wife and 4 kids) homesteading just little over two years ago. I've been educating & experiencing a lot of different things myself. I have goats, chickens, did have two turkeys (named Thanksgiving & Christmas), a pig (named porkchop by my wife), rabbits, cats and a dog. I get emotionally attached easily with all animals, but I try to be balanced about it when it comes to "harvesting" goats, pig and chickens for meat, I try to be as merciful and quick, but it's hard not to cry my eyes out when they die; but afterwards when it come to dressing and butchering, it doesn't bother me. Even the pig, he was like a pet, very intelligent, ornery(sp), and loyal too. It was heartbreaking even my kids cry too. I'm sorry for being too emotional about this as I write about my livestock experiencs, I just wanted to open myself to all you countrysiders as well. I know and I teach my sons that you're not much of a man if you don't cry (not as in being gutless or self "pity party"). But my point is that I'm (along with my family) still learning, and by experiencing so far, this is the most profitable and fulfilling for me. This so much better than just coming home from work, mowing the lawn, and watching TV alone.

-- David Cripe (cripeland@aol.com), March 16, 2001.

Love my girls definately.... my goaite girls and bad goaite boys that is. I never ever thought of raising goats in my life, my father never did and I always had the perception that they stunk and ate tin cans. Well.... they will eat rose bushes (Jackie ate 150 hybrid tea roses, 3 tree rose bushes, climbing roses and all my lilac bushes in a matter of a few days, she got out while we were away and our son was goatsitting) and no, they don't eat tin cans, but the boys sure do smell sometimes, nothing a little coffee doesn't take care of though.

I like cows, but goats definately have personalities and they have a way of making you respect them. Second to goats i love my dogs.

-- Bernice (geminigoats@yahoo.com), March 16, 2001.

Bernice, we had a milk goat that ate crazy stuff. I was building my first barn (the one that burned down), and Penelope got her mouth into a box of inch and 5/8 galvanized drywall screws. When I went to grab the box from her, she quick-gobbled down three or four of them. Yikes, We didn't quite know what to do, but it didn't seem to phase her, and she produced pretty good (gallon or more) for the next 2 or 3 years, until we eventually sold her to refresh our stock with her kids and grandkids. STRANGE... Sonya, I've gotta agree with Dee, about PIGS. You raise two, sell one, it pays for the two, and you've still got a whole pig in the freezer for your trouble. Last week I pre-sold my friend at work on buying half a pig from us. Today, he remarked how meat prices seemed to be suddenly going up, since the FMD scare. Also that he was glad to get some local, organic type meat at our low rate. I told him my wife was considering hoisting the prices, but, shucks, we're not running a LUMBER company, that sells you last year's wood at next month's prices... Dee, Ditto on the 250 lbs. Pigs seem meaner around that weight, and besides ME getting snapped at, I would worry about them getting ahold of a child, if they should fall in the pen. 250 lbs? Yep, cut em up. Mmm Mmm, good!

-- The Action Dude (theactiondude@yahoo.com), March 16, 2001.

Strictly from an economic standpoint I would list bees,chickens and goats in that order.If I could keep only one it would be the goats hands down.Though we have 2 dogs and a cat I would put them at the bottom of the list.The Maremma bitch does a great job of guarding the goats but that is about the only good thing I can say for her.She poops all over the place,digs holes you could lose a tractor in gooses me in the butt when I least expect it.And then there's the cat.Maybe one day it will be a "good"cat.

-- JT (gone2seed@hotmail.com), March 16, 2001.

I really am impressed with all these replies! Until we can get our house built at our farm, I am afraid I will have to be content living vicariously through all these posts and learning what you all are willing to share. You make my day, each day as I read and spend too much time at this box when I'd rather be out "hoe"ing, fishing, milking, .... you get my point. Right now, I am getting the house ready to sell here in town and scanning every classified ad for some mobile home our family of 5 can squeeze into at the farm while we build our house and barn ourselves. Thank you for sharing this part of your life. Cheers!

-- Sonya (clb@watervalley.net), March 16, 2001.

Definately, the milk cow. Our Jersey has been milking for one year. (We will dry her up in May, - to calve in July).

She has kept us in milk all this time and raised six calves. (Two at a time in her early lactation and then, one at a time now. - We take what we want - calf gets the rest)

$2.50 gallon of milk each day for the house. All the cottage cheese we could ever eat, Colby, cheddar, gouda, montasio, ramano, mozzerella and - oh, the butter.

Milk for puddings, pies, custards and have 60 quarts of milk canned for the time she is dry.

It takes planning and determination to use the milk efficiently and not just end up with a refrigerator sitting full of containers of milk.

She takes more time than our chickens, but, if I had to choose between milk products or the eggs - tough call, but have to choose the cow.

-- homestead2 (homestead@localnetplus.com), March 16, 2001.

Any of the poultry: chickens (small initial investment, some cracked corn, mash...minimal); ducks (free to us...some cracked corn); geese (free to us) and they eat pasture grass and sometimes hay with the sheep. The birds give us eggs all year and great fertilizer, plus they control the bug population, and more importantly around here, the slug population! I sell the eggs and break even on a year-round basis.

The goats are probably next, only because their expense is relatively low to their cost (wethers, free, and they get meds, hay, grain, etc.) but they keep the brush down. Next up is sheep (they were a large investment but we get pay-backs from wool, and if I ever sell any lambs! Plus the fertilizer is incredible. They also "manage" our pastures.)

All the larger animals have barns which we built ourselves. The chickens have a nice insulated henhouse that we built, too. We are good at salvage and scrounging, and most of our materials came from those resources. Still, fencing, barns, gates, electricity (minimal...New Zealand fencing) plus hay, grain, minerals, etc., each year, adds up. I wouldn't say that this is a very profitable operation, but then I never really intended for it to be.

Most expensive critters are the cats! Their vaccinations, worming, occasional vet trip, etc., seems to be much more expensive per capita than the larger animals! They keep the rodent population down and provide entertainment, too. But I think they are the most expensive.

We don't have horses, speaking of expenses! Someday, we may have mules, though. No dogs, either....but again, someday. After winning the Lotto.

-- sheepish (WA) (rborgo@gte.net), March 17, 2001.

Hands down it has to be my Morgan mare. She gives me hours of pleasure riding and raises a nice foal every year which I sell for enough moola to more than pay her keep. Last spring she produced an excellent filly which I recently sold for a hefty price to a show oriented home. I also have a nicely bred appy mare who is preggo for the 1st time so we'll see how that goes. However, I don't recommend folks get into horses for the money...most people lose way more than they make and horses require lots of care.

-- elle (eagle-quest@juno.com), March 18, 2001.

Okay, this is probably a stupid question but I'm gonna ask it anyway...do people eat their goats?

-- Betsy in NY (sassyweitzel@yahoo.com), March 21, 2001.

Yes! Goat sausage- yum!

-- Rebekah (daniel1@itss.net), March 21, 2001.

I would definitely put goats at the top of my list. Chickens next, then meat animals, then the bee-hives. Dogs can be nice, and useful if properly trained, but it's like having toddlers around, you have to watch them all the time. (I have two puppies, and will be very thankful when they are full-grown!) Cats go on the very bottom of the list. We have one cat that I want to find another home for (she was dumped). Our old one that is almost eleven will be here til she dies, but I don't plan to replace her. I *like* cats, nice and warm and purring on your lap, but there are too many problems (I *hate* litter boxes; the dogs do a better job of keeping the rodent population down; cats will use the hay and grain for litter boxes, and the garden; etc.)

-- Kathleen Sanderson (stonycft@worldpath.net), March 21, 2001.

Meat chickens! They take relatively little space. Convert feed to meat efficiently (especially if you use a "chicken tractor" so they can graze), are ready to butcher at 6 weeks to 12, depending upon how large a carcass you want, and can be processed by one person. It takes me about 20 minutes to go from "on the hoof" to dressed. (Cool them for one day before you freeze them). And believe me, you will not become emotionally attached! GL!

-- Brad (homefixer@SacoRiver.net), March 21, 2001.