favorite breed survey (cows) (Cattle - Dairy)

greenspun.com : LUSENET : Countryside : One Thread

I have decided to spend the next few years gaining as much knowledge as possible about cows. I will also be looking around for any equipment I might need for processing the milk. To all of you who have ever had cows, I pose this question: What's your favorite breed and why? I realize some of you are going to give me article-length answers; that's fine. I've got time to read whatever you send.

To help you help me, here are my plans for the family cow: I buy a heifer and have her bred at the appropriate time. She gives birth to, say, another heifer, which we keep or sell, depending on our need at the moment. Or, say she has a bull calf. We cut him and either raise him for drafting or fatten him for beef. Meanwhile, we milk mama and get enough from her for: milk, cheese, butter, ice cream, etc. There are 8 "milk-aholics" in this family. And, yes, we all love raw milk.

Also, we live in Canada, so any breed you suggest will have to be fairly well established in Canada as the importing costs are far too prohibitive for fear of spreading hoof-and-mouth.

One more thing: Please don't tell me how your favorite goat can do as much for less. This thread is not about goats, largely because most of the members of this family can't enjoy the milk. And, yes, we have tried it. I have milked goats for friends on vacation who said we could keep the milk. Everyone in the family tasted it; only 3 out of 8 liked it well enough to drink it every day.

Thanks so much for all you have to say.

-- Cathy N. (keeper8@attcanada.ca), August 25, 2001

Answers

Response to favorite breed survey (cows)

Cathy, I bought a Dexter Cow... Thinking she would be more fisable for our size family... Well, she was 2 and wild when we got her, and she has not mellowed much. I don't have a head gate to milk her in, so needless to say, I have never milked her. She likes to throw "love taps" my way if I stand beside her. They say that the Dexter is a calmer breed, I have not found this to be so with the cow I have and with her offspring. Last year, we bought a 5 day old registered Jersey Heifer. I bottle fed her goats milk until she was 6 months old. She thinks she is a goat! I call her my Lap Cow... She is the sweetest thang! I had her halter broke by 10 days old She follows me everywhere, and will come running if I call her name! The Dairy man who sold her to me, has recently tried to buy her back... I know he sold her to me in the first place because she was very small and probably did not come from real good milking lines. Which was fine with me, as I did not want a large cow, or one who gave me 8 gallons a day! I guess all that goat milk has paid off, she is on the larger size now for her age. She has a very sweet personality, and lets me rub her all over. We had her A.I. a few months ago. She will freshen in March of 2002. I am very happy with Jersey. I am not sure if a Dexter, in the same situation..(being Bottle fed) would prove to be just as gentle or not. If my Dexter has a heifer calf this time, I may just take it from Mom and stick bull calf on her and hand raise the baby Dexter. We are very happy with the weight gain of the Dexter steer. He is 15 months old and weights about 750 lbs. He should give us about 50% table meat when butchered. (that is something to consider when deciding on what kind of milk cow you want) I know a jersey steer takes longer to reach butcher weight! I hope this helps you some in your decision. I have some dexter facts on my web site www.rockinredranch.com Ginny

-- Ginny D (yehagirl@rockinredranch.com), August 25, 2001.

Okay, but remember you asked for it! : ) I can just about guaruntee you that everyone is gonna tell you Jersey or Dexter. People seem to think the smaller the better, kinda like a big goat that happens to give cow's milk. But a cow is a cow is a...well, anyway. My favorite is a Guernsey. I was raised on a small farm that nowadays would be considered a homestead. Chickens, pigs, ducks, huge gardens, but always the milk cows. And usually Guernseys. I was "given" my first Guernsey for my 5th birthday, and yes, at 5 years old I milked her--couldn't lift the milk pail, of course, and sometimes I finished milking before Mama or Dad had come up to the barn to get the milk, and I could run down to the house and get one of them to come get the milk, leaving the bucket under the cow, and never having to worry about it being kicked over. Later, as more local people gave up their milk cow, Daddy added more cows,in order to sell milk. Milk cows were expensive--$100. in those days, but Daddy got a lot of Jersey's thrown in, because there was always someone looking to give them away. What I remember most was that when the Guernseys were in their stanchions, we used to sing to the rhythem of the milking, we always were laughing and playing, the littler kids playing hide-and-go seek under the bellies of the cows, and playing in-and-out-the-windows under the cows'legs. My youngest sister is deaf, and she had an un-naturally loud and shrill voice, but the Guernseys just seem to understand her, and she never frightend them. Now, I am gonna date myself here, but back in those days the cows all had horns, too. When I got big enough that my little brother and I could carry a milk bucket between us, One on each side, we were allowed to milk alone, I was supposed to milk, and he was supposed to do the other chores and feed the calves, etc. Hey! We were kids. Didn't take long before he milked on the "off" side while I milked on the near, and we had a great time...kids are great at coming up with "fun in their work". Lots of times we forgot to close the stanchions, and broke all the rules Daddy had laid down, because it didn't matter. But whenever we had Jerseys in the barn, it was serious business. SSHHH...was the word. My baby sister had to be taken down to the house, Dad didn't let us kids milk. We were in charge of shoving hay in front of them once they finished their grain, because the Jerseys wouldn't "stand". Don't get me wrong, they weren't mean or anything, they were just nervous, or maybe I should say high-strung. But the Guernseys were always placid. Even on our small farm, they (the Jerseys) ended up as hamburger, not because of their nervousness per se, but because they wouldn't 'settle' because of their nervousness, getting them to re-breed AI was almost impossible. There were exceptions. One of my favorite cows ever was a Jersey named Daisy. She was as gentle as you could wish for a cow, gave copious amounts of milk, and just loved us kids. Her udder hung almost to the ground, but once you got the bucket under her, she practically milked herself. She was the only cow my dad ever thought was worth paying a vet bill for, when she sliced her udder open with her hoof, and when she came into the barn pouring blood and milk out onto the floor. The vet put in stitches, which didn't hold, and then told daddy the only thing to do was to send her for hamburger, us kids all cried our eyes out, and up until my mother died years later, was the only time I ever saw my dad cry. But, I degress. I happen to really like the yellow cream of the Guernsey, and therefore the yellow butter. I like their disposition, I like how feed efficient they are. They have such a good ratio of "calving ease" that you can breed even a first calf heifer to a small-headed Hereford, and if you breed them back to Guernsey, you are practically guarunteed no calving problems. But, to the rest of your problem, they've gotten so rare in the last 20 years that they are almost extinct, when you do find one, expect to pay boo-coo bucks, when you can probably get a Jersey on the cheap. There are websites, www.usguernsey.com--and I'm sure if you get a search going, you will find the American Jersey association, too. But since the USDA has just approved the new pricing system, where the farmer gets premium price on butterfat, protein and solids-non-fat, the worth of Guernseys, and Jerseys has gone up considerably. Also, never discount the Brown Swiss. They are BIG, but just about as gentle as the Guernsey, with a higher milk production...and their calves are quite meaty, especially when crossed with a beef breed. They are in high demand right now, because of the fact that they have really strong legs, that hold up better than the Holsteins that are usually confined on concrete. I should add at this point that I have no personal experience with Holsteins, except that I know because of their high milk/low butterfat-protein ratio, they are rarely thought of as a "family cow." Also, I should note at this time, that no matter what breed you decide on, when you get a heifer, breed her to a small calf breed...Angus if you decide to breed beef, or Jersey if you decide to breed dairy...better to lose a year of beef than to lose your cow. You didn't ask about beef, but my favorite is Limosine, but that is something you would never breed to any dairy cow, except maybe a Holstein, but then, never a first calf heifer. I hope I have helped your 'survey'. Kathie

-- Kathie in Western Washington (twinrosefarm@centurytel.net), August 26, 2001.

Cathy, I think that the posts so far have been excellent! I have always had Jerseys, and have been happy with them. I recommended to someone recently that they could get a good deal on a cow in a commercial herd, that was nearing the end of her usefulness there, but would have years left in a family situation. Said cow would already be used to milking, and maybe been shown, so might be a very good cow. Then I remembered Blossom, my first cow, and first Jersey. I bought her as a heifer--she was a dark Jersey with horns, because the family that had her liked horns. She had a precocious udder, and we put a little Charlais calf on her that had lost her mother. She was bred the first time AI. She never gave me the first problem. I think that the Guernseys would be a great cow also, but have always had Jerseys, so don't know.

-- Judy in IN (whileaway3@cs.com), August 26, 2001.

Jersey, Guernsey, or maybe an Ayredale but the Ayredale is not really very common any more. I personally like Jerseys, but have been told Guernsey milk is better for making cheese. Something about the fat particle size. I have only made raw cheeses, and only from raw Jersey milk, and that seemed fine to me, but there you go. Aged cheese might be different, and I've never made cheese from Guernsey milk at all.

I've had people tell me Jerseys are flighty, but you couldn't prove it by me. I've never met a flighty Jersey. Of course, individuals of any breed vary.

One thing, Jersey bulls are smart as whips and twice as mean. They are MEAN. If you do get a Jersey and she throws a bull calf, cut it right away. Don't wait. I'm told more people are killed by Jersey bulls than all other breeds (of bulls) combined. I don't know that that's true, but it's not far from the truth, I'm sure. I know some folks like to wait to cut their bull calves sometimes because they say they put weight on better, but don't try it with a Jersey bull calf, its just not worth the risk, IMNSHO.

If you've never calved a cow before, you might not want to start off with a heifer. I figure one of us ought to know what they're doing. I would suggest getting an older cow that has calved a few times, and is used to being milked and handled. My comfort level would be higher with an older cow. YMMV.

Personal preference, I don't like the Dexters. For your family (8 milk drinkers) there is no reason whatsoever to consider a Dexter anyway.

Jerseys are NOT small cows any more. They're smaller than Holsteins, but that's not saying a lot. When I was a kid, Jerseys were small. A 1000 lb Jersey was huge then. Now its about par for the course, they've been breeding them up (bigger is better). They're a medium size cow now. Guernseys when I was a kid were slightly larger than Jerseys, can't say how they are for size now.

-- Sojourner (notime4@summer.spam), August 26, 2001.


Well at the last fair I went to in Mt. Grove the Guernseys were comparable to the Holsteins in size, I couldn't believe it. I do like Dexters, our Dexter bull is the calmest bovine on our place. But, for your size family of milk drinkers it would not suit you. It does sound like you do need a dual purpose breed though. No one has mentioned the Shorthorn (still known as the Durham in some places). One could say they give lots of beef for a milk breed or one could say they give lots of milk for a beef breed. Good amount of cream, yellow if on grass, more whitish if on hay. Pretty good temperment, we got one recently that had had a rough time and was very distrustful, but is calming down daily. Good calving ease. Smaller size. Good forager. Good luck! Tana

-- Tana Cothran (tana@getgoin.net), August 26, 2001.


My favorite breed is any cow that is a pleasure to be around, that milks reasonabally well and is a good mother , calves without difficulity, breeds without difficulity and lives a strong and healthy life. Don't worry so much about breed as disposition and useability,

-- Diane In Idaho (oleoranch3@aol.com), August 26, 2001.

If Herefords were black and Angus were red, would breeders of Herefords breed Angus instead? I mean, would the people who bred Herefords first be now breeding Angus if things were reversed?

Or would they be loyal to red white and true to color of cowlick be always true blue? If such were the case, would they dis all the blacks, tell jokes about prolapse, compare them to yaks?

Debate would rage on like it does anyway if the South had worn blue or the North had worn grey, or if Henry Ford had been Hank Chevrolet, you'd still be a Ford man. . . or would you, today?

So if Herefords were black and Angus were red would breeders of Herefords breed Angus instead? The question begs deep philosophical thought, but don't get disgruntled or get overwrought.

The breeders of purebreds run true to the grain, and efforts to change them would all be in vain, and not 'cause they think other cattle are bad, "I'm stickin' with this one, 'cause that's what Dad had".

Excerpts from Baxter Black's poem "If Herefords Were Black".

-- Paul (hoyt@egyptian.net), August 26, 2001.


That's Ayrshire, not Ayredale. Good info on the breed is available at http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/breeds/cattle/ , then look at Ayrshire.

-- Laura Jensen (lrjensen@nwlink.com), August 26, 2001.

Cathy, I have a sweet Jersey, and I absolutely love her. But she still is too high bred for my tastes, as she has to have grain to maintain her weight. If she doesnt get enough grain, she loses weight and keeps putting the milk out. That is not good. So I dream of breeding her to a miniature beef breed, like Hereford or other easily managed breed. NO ANGUS. Those are wild at heart, hard to manage. I would like to play around with Jersey crosses with a Miniature breed till I come up with an ideal sweet-tempered Jersey mix homestead cow. I bet I could breed them to sell...

-- daffodyllady (daffodyllady@yahoo.com), August 26, 2001.

I plead being asleep at the keyboard. Had to go get my son from a party last night at midnight, tore the car up on the way back up those folks driveway (deep ruts, managed to shove the exhaust up into the linkage for the standard transmission, now it is hard to shift) Woke up this morning and called a cow a dog. *sigh*.

-- Sojourner (notime4@summer.spam), August 26, 2001.


I don't have any cows and never have had. Since you are now in Canada how about a Canadienne? :o) I would like either a Guernsey, Jersey, or Canadienne myself.

-- Alison in N.S. (aproteau@istar.ca), August 27, 2001.

To check out Canadiennes look here......... http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/breeds/cattle/

-- Alison in N.S. (aproteau@istar.ca), August 27, 2001.

Have a look at Red Poll cattle. They are a dual purpose breed - reasonably good milkers and produce fine beef as well. Naturally polled, docile and easy calving too! Many to be found in Western Canada.

-- RMS (dnls@hotmail.com), August 27, 2001.

I have a 6 year old Jersey/Holstein cross who gave 80# of milk a day since her first freshening and has excellent butterfat content. I've had her since she was 3 days old and she follows me around and comes when she is called. SHe also liked to 'play' a lot when she was a 2 year old and sent me flying with head butts a few times, but has since settled down.

-- Dianne (yankeeterrier@hotmail.com), August 31, 2001.

Keeper,

I switched to the Dexter breed. ( Previously I have milked Jersey and Jersey/Holstein crosses0....).

I wanted less milk, and I like the smaller cow.

Dexter cattle have naturally homogenized milk. Genetically speaking a Dexter bull can be expected to be docile and laid back. Dexters eat HALF as much as other cows, and they make better use of it. A Dexter will thrive on sparse forage, even weeds, while you watch the other breeds dwindle to skin and bones. I have NEVER had a birthing problem with my cows( and I have a large herd). Another genetic trait is ease of calving.

Dexter meat is called "unique" by many. Bulls can be butchered without castration and the meat will not be tainted. Dexter meat is very good. Smaller cuts of course but the taste IS unique.

A hand raised Dexter is just as spoiled as a hand raised anything else. A never handled Dexter is just as wild as any other unhandled creature. I have had quite a few Dexters that were never handled when I got them, and all of them grew to trust me, and to eat grain out of a held bucket. . . and then my hand. . .. within short periods of time. All but one of them I eventually milked when they freshened. They are very intelligent, and have long memories, so it is better to work with an unhandled one gently to gain it's trust and cooperation.

I have seen a couple of difficult Dexters. . . . and have wondered why. . . however, this breed has won me over big time ! ! They are great little cows!

-- Judy McFerrin (JMcFerrin@aol.com), September 01, 2001.



Now I am intrigued! I have been looking up info on the Dexters and actually found some for sale locally. Maybe Dexters will find their way here.hee hee. My question is this...I only have 4.7 acres, part of which is forested. Maybe 3.5 is cleared and we are fencing for the sheep. Would we have enough space for a little Dexter cow?

-- Alison in N.S. (aproteau@istar.ca), September 07, 2001.

If Dexter milk is homogenized or even semi-homogenized (like goats milk) that means you can't separate the cream out without the use of a mechanical cream seperator. Hand cranked ones are over $200, and not much less used generally because collectors think they're a cool decoration for the living room. ALso used ones are often zinc coated, which is not considered food safe anymore. That means you will have great difficulty making butter, or real ice cream, without a cream seperator.

Just something to consider.

-- Sojourner (notime4@summer.spam), September 07, 2001.


Moderation questions? read the FAQ