Anti terrorism act: no more bartering! : LUSENET : Freedom! self reliance : One Thread

Just happening to be downloading the complete "USA Patriot" Bill, which is a cutesy little acronym standing for, of all things, "Uniting and Strengthening America Act by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism" Here's the url; I won't paste it into this post, as it's LOOOONG!

While it was loading, I just happened to notice the following; I haven't read the act yet, but I'm sure there's plenty of verbiage of interest to us all:

``(F) Assist Federal, State, local, and foreign law enforcement and regulatory authorities in combatting the use of informal, nonbank networks and payment and BARTER SYSTEM mechanisms that permit the transfer of funds or the equivalent of funds without records and without compliance with criminal and tax laws.

I wonder if this includes buying things with CASH???


-- joj (jump@off.c), October 30, 2001


Wow! I've seen a lot of things lately that bothered or worried me but this takes the cake! That looks like they really are preparing for a cashless society (I knew that but hoped it was further down the line) and are preparing a way to arrest those of us who won't go along with it.

-- Deena in GA (, October 30, 2001.

Just remember that it takes a while for law enforcement agents to catch up to the laws that are on the books. Somebody has to interpret them, then somebody else makes to enforce them. Then they have to catch you!

I can just see it now....You pay your babysitter with cash and the FBI busts in on you as you are making the deal!

I know you questioned whether or not it included cash but that sure is what it looks like to me delete some of the words to make it plain and easy to understand....

combatting the use of informal, nonbank mechanisms that permit the tranfer of funds or the equivalent of funds without records.

AND without compliance with criminal and tax laws.

In other words, if you do something that there is a tax law for and you don't keep a reciept to incriminat yourself, you are a terrorist and they will come to get you.

-- Stephanie Nosacek (, October 30, 2001.

In other words, if I trade a jar of honey for some squash, I and my trading partner could go to jail for it.

-- Kathleen Sanderson (, October 30, 2001.

They are not worried about the millions of everyday small cash transactions. They are looking for the international arms dealers who pay with a suitcase full of $1000 bills. If "they" wanted to get you, they already have hundreds of federal laws on the books that we all unkowingly break everyday. For example, did you know it is a federal crime to remove prescription medicine from the pharmacy bottle and place it in another container, such as the daily pill reminder things? How many photocopies of copyrighted material do you have laying around your house? If the government decides you are an enemy of the state, they don't have to work very hard to put you away. The key is to just blend in and not be noticed. Don't put up any red flags and they won't waste their time on you. Big Brother still has limited resources.

-- skip (, October 30, 2001.

I believe the point is going to come where you simply will not be able to blend in if you don't want to be part of the brave New World. Skip, I mean this with all respect, but you are operating on on a pre 911 basis. The "ubiquitous they" (thanks, Lesley!!) can now imprison you if they WANT to....PERIOD.

Not even the very best CPA's can agree on the tax laws. So squah for honey could be a felony-whoops! no more votey vote for you, my fellow citizen! What were those quotes about society and government??? A moral society needs very few laws (?)- and the government that governs best governs least. Seems we have a problem here, huh?

-- Doreen (, October 30, 2001.

This would definitely impact me, as I have no credit cards and refuse to get one. I do this to simplify and save myself money.

No credit cards mean no one stealing card information. No credit report mistakes. No monthly payments. No christmas spending shock (my God, did I spend all that?).

Using only cash for transactions is so easy; either you have the money, or you don't. Paying with cash saves me money because I am much more conscious of spending it. Credit card transaction; sign on dotted line. Check book transaction: sign name and write cost of item. Cash transaction: pull out green backs and count it out. Which is more painful; last one in my opinion.

-- j. r. guerra (, October 31, 2001.

Skip, you said, "The key is to just blend in and not be noticed. Don't put up any red flags and they won't waste their time on you. Big Brother still has limited resources".

Problem is, for me at least, I'm very outspoken and public. I write lots of letters to the editor of my local paper. I am chairman of a Citizens Advisory Committee (a neighborhood group which, by following certain rules and regulations insofar as being representative of the neighorhood) is "acknowledged" by the county government. I speak my mind against the loss of our liberties and against killing innocent civilians in Afghanistan, and all the other places where we have committed atrocities.

You may not agree with my politics, Skip; I don't know. I do know that if you "blend in" and avoid being "noticed", you are going to be herded in whatever direction "they" want to herd you. Sort of like a lamb being led to slaughter. Of course, the lamb thinks everything is fine, too, right up to the slaughterhouse.


-- joj (jump@off.c), October 31, 2001.

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