Corrugated cardboard insulation

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I've come across an article in the Fall 2001 issue of Oxford American magazine telling the work of architect Samuel Mockbee, a MacArthur foundation grant recipient and professor at Auburn University. He designs, and then has his students build, places for the soul, otherwise known as houses. The truly impressive thing about his work and teaching is that he builds these homes out of scrap...the things our society usually discards and never wants to see again...and the result is a home that is much more nurturing to the soul then the ticky-tacky, cookie cutter boxes selling for hundreds of thousands of dollars. It is encouraging that poor people in our country can now afford their own homes, but also have homes that are actually more aesthetically pleasing than the McHouses of subdivisions. Anyway, the thing about the article that really caught my attention is the use of wax impregnated cardboard, compressed into cotton bale-sized blocks weighing 600 pounds each, with insulation values "off the charts". In their former life these boxes were used for shipping frozen chickens. One of the questions I have is, "what are the dimensions of a cotton-bale"? Perhaps they could be used to infill between a timber-framed house, as hay bales are now being used. The article was enjoyable but left me with unansweree questions. Anyone know the size of a cotton bale?

-- John Fritz (JohnFritz24@hotmail.com), November 28, 2001

Answers

Bale size is usually about 4' x 4' x 6', but it varies depending on how modern the machinery is. Some of the newest machines produce round bales about 6' across and 6' long.

-- Paul D. (pd-personal@qwest.net), November 28, 2001.

Wouldn't cardboard soaked in was be a fire hazard?

-- Mindy Magoo (mindymagoo@magoo.com), November 28, 2001.

That sure was my first thought, Mindy!

MissJudi

-- MissJudi (jselig@clemson.edu), November 28, 2001.


shredded newspaper,, cotton,, and steel wool was allused as insulationa t one time,, steel wool is the most flammable,, would all depends on the barrier used,, concrete,,stucco,, ect. Straw bales are flammable,, but they are coted/covered with concrete

-- stan (sopal@net-port.com), November 28, 2001.

Cotton bales, here in NC (where there are quite a few of them) are normally 12 foot long by 6 ft wide by 4 to 6 feet high. Smaller machinery measure bales at 6 by 6 by 6. These things are no where NEAR 600 lbs, though. They regire a double rear axle truck to transport just one. A 600 lb bale of compressed card board- I have also worked in a paper and carboard recycling facility- would probabally maesure UNDER (especially with wax) 4 by 4 by 4. Cardboard has quite a bit of value if recycled. I wonder why this means was chosen- I think stone would be a better way to go- its free, lasts indefinetly and can be easier to work with (try lifting a 600 lb bale by just yourself).

-- Kevin in NC (Vantravlrs@aol.com), November 28, 2001.


They now use recycled newspaper as insulation, blown in type, but it has to be treated with a fire retardant. Using wax would make it go up really fast. We had a piece of fabric that we had coated with parrifin to make it semi water proof to cover some wood we had got but did not have a place to properly store it at the time. After we got the wood into a building I took the fabric to the burn barrel and lit it what a fire. Cheap is not usually safe. You have to make some choices, when you are building, choseing something that is a fire hazard should never be done. Better living in a cave than a possible inferno. Just my opinion. And while we are on the insulation subject we store hay bales and straw bales in a seperate building far from the other outbuildings because of the fire hazard. Bales of straw or hay if allowed to get wet will ignite all by themselves. They will go through a heat and catch fire. After finding where some had got wet by a leak in the roof and had burnt out the centers we decided to never store bales of anything in the barn with the equipment and tools. If you use hay bales for construction remember to be sure there is no way they can get wet because of the fire danger. Guess fire is just one thing I am really afraid of. Straw construction is a good idea just be sure you keep it dry and sealed up.

-- David (bluewaterfarm@mindspring.com), November 28, 2001.

i am shure they are refering to the waxed boxes used for shipping vegtables i dont think they are recycalable like the unwaxed cardbord i have seen the waxed cases flattened and used in a shingle like manner as a siding and it last a long time used in that manner

-- george darby (windwillow@fuse.net), November 28, 2001.

I'd guess we're talking the same sort of thing as straw bales - sealed in stucco. Straw will burn - sure. However, if you've got straw sealed inside cement, there just isn't enough air for it to burn. Hit it with a sledgehammer, then light the straw you see - it will go out - the burning straw will generate so much carbon dioxide that it will almost instantly smother any fire that gets started inside the cement box.

-- Don Armstrong (darmst@yahoo.com.au), November 29, 2001.

600 lbs is VERY HEAVY! If a bale of straw -- and that's the building material, folks, not hay! -- weighs 80 lbs, and you stack them 6 high per storey, that's only 480lbs spread over about 2ftx4ft of your foundation, and then you add in the weight of the stucco. If you stack 600lb bales of anything 6 high, you've got 3,600lbs to support on a 2'x4'area of foundation, before you even add stucco, which is very heavy, too. Which means you need to have a pretty massive foundation.

By the way, I have just finished building a 2 storey strawbale up-to-code house. Don't let anyone tell you it's easy or fast. Yeah, maybe if you have 30 volunteers for the entire project the whole time! There is a massive amount of prepwork you need to do every step of the way, and none of the books or videos or magazine articles tell you about that. I just wanted to mention that. I LOVE my house, it is beautiful, unique, superinsulated, quiet & solid, but if I had known how much sheer work it would be, I might have chosen another building technique. Don't run out of money and lose your momentum, because it is hard to get re-started and keep going. Perhaps I will forget how hard it has been...like labour pains....

-- snoozy (bunny@northsound.net), November 29, 2001.


Good info in this thread. I would really like to know the r-value of just plain corrugated cardboard from boxes, if it is stacked into piles say, 1" thick. Better than styrofoam? Worse? Anyone know the answer? Joel

-- Joel Acheson (joeljed@hotmail.com), January 18, 2002.


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