I stopper in a little diner in Moorfield, WV. yesterday, it was allmost deserted except the one table of local coffee soppers; the topic of discussion was a review of local business closings due to the new presence of a big box store. These locals were long time residents in one of those places where everybody knows everybodies shoe size, ancestors, and dogs name; they counted up 21 different small family businesses that went under due to the competitison from the box store. Every thing from stores selling hardwear, housepaint, childrens clothes, garden supplies, auto repair, tire, groceries, electronics, gift shop, the list just goes on and on.

Were any of these small family businesses compensated for their loss? I think not and I further think these big box stores should be required to purchase at full market value the businesses they are going to destroy. How would your community react to the presence of one of these stores? That older woman everybody knows as Granny, who runs the gift and card shop, what would she do now? Or Jack, the tire store manager who after church hand delivered a tractor tire tube because rain was comming and you had to get the hay in today? What about Connie, your favorite cashier at Smith & Son Grocery whom attended your wedding? What about these peoples income and seniority at their jobs?

Yes, these stores do hire people; Yes you do get something in return for sending your money to China; what do you see now in these stores that says Made in America?

Yes, I have given you something to think about, I wish I could give you something to DO about it. All I can suggest is to spread this message the next time there is a rumor of a big box moving in to your town.

-- mitch hearn (moopups@citlink.net), December 18, 2001

Answers

In a neighboring town there used to be about 6 good groceries to choose from,several mom and pop and some bigger franchises but I liked to go to a couple and shop around. Last year a SuperCenter Wal- Mart came to town. Everyone was excited, even me. Now, all 6 grocery stores are closed and the only choice you have is Wal-Mart. I like Wal-Mart and not bad mouthing the least but what can you do? There were special things I bought at each store and Wal-Mart doesn't carry and I have asked and they won't carry. So where do I go?I do not like being forced to shop in one place for a certian price, etc.. To go anywhere else is conciderable out of my way. We do go to Joplin(1 1/2hours away) several times a year but what about monthly or weekly? I guess I am just venting because I feel so helpless, besides spending more time and money to go way out of my way I am stuck buying from a Name not the friendly face from down the road.!

-- Micheale from SE Kansas (mbfrye@totelcsi.net), December 18, 2001.

You are right mitch . . . the small family run five and dimes are following the examples of the corner grocery stores of the '80s and '90s; they are getting very scarce.

And the funny thing is that the owners of these small businesses can teach the big box stores a thing or two about the clientele; after all, the small businesses have been catering and selling to them for years. You would think the box stores would really be trying to hire the old owners as at the very least, floor managers; people really respond to a familiar face. Really sad.

Between Wal-Mart, K-mart, and Sams Club, our downtown district is a shambles. Downtown is now basically a bargain bazaar.

-- j.r. guerra (jrguerra@boultinghousesimpson.com), December 18, 2001.

Well, I hate to see the small guy go, but they go for one reason. The people dont want to shop at the small guy store. Its not wall marts fault. Its the buyers fault. You want a small town store, then support a small town store.

Money going to china has nothing to do with walmart. The small guy store handling low price items will more than likley send his money overseas as well.

-- Gary (gws@columbus.rr.com), December 18, 2001.

We don't like Wal-Mart, we do shop there. For while we were buying more from family businesses merchants, but money's so tight now, I'm sure it'll be mostly Wal-Mart. Then again, I'd like to get to where I didn't 'need' to shop there at all, except maybe dog food and toilet paper.

-- Cindy (SE. IN) (atilrthehony@hotmail.com), December 18, 2001.

It is a very difficult decision when you have children, and not much money. Do you support the "little guy" and spend more? Or do you go to the discount stores because that is all you can afford?? We try to compromise. We always support our local gas station. Even if he is a few cents more. It is a family busines, plus several of our friends work there as mechanics. This fall I needed new tires. I dropped off the van, and walked to the library to work for a while. When I came back, Greg had discovered another problem, and had already ordered the part and had it laying on the counter. Yes the tires may have been $5 more each, but he literally probably saved our lives (I think it was tie-rod ends???) I doubt Wal-mart would have checked!! they send us a bill at the end of the month, with 3 months to pay no interest. I will ride home on fumes before I will buy gas in town!! I know these people they know me and my family, so I trust them 100%. We try to do this with several small businesses around. It is important to support your community if at all possible. Many times we will say, we would rather give our money to the little guy!!

-- Melissa (me@home.net), December 18, 2001.

I feel compelled to comment. When I was a child, my mother and father ran a small, corner grocery store in Green Bay,WI. There those mom-and-pop grocery stores all over the city. Then Red Owl Stores came in and the little stores went belly-up. This happened over forty years ago, so it isn't anything new. And, it isn't just Wal-Mart!

-- Ardie /WI (ardie54965@hotmail.com), December 18, 2001.

We buy 98% of everything we need to buy at the neighborhood stores and always have..the other 2% is only when the local owners do not carry what I want. I HATE these so called super stores...when they threatened to build one in our neighborhood in PA, all the folks told them they would not shop there and they did NOT..the store closed six months after it opened....What could those stores have that is so much more expensive than the locally owned stores????? I guess because I never bought things such as breakfast cereals, etc....that has to be it, because I just do not see the difference. Rather than lose local stores, if folks really care that much (and I think they should), they ought to evaluate what they NEED to buy.....we also were fortunate to have a locally-owned discount grocery..when I wanted to buy something in bulk, I went there. Here in AL, we have a small country store three miles away where I do all my grocery shopping..they are not any more expensive than the huge Winn Dixie in town. What are folks buying that the need to go to Walmart, etc... I truly do not understand?????????????????????????

-- lesley (martchas@bellsouth.net), December 18, 2001.

Our locally owned grocery in town will special order anything I want. Yes, it may be a few cents more, but the Nearest Wal-mart is twenty miles of snaky road away, so I consider the cost of gas plus my sanity-there are several fatal wrecks on this road each year. Plus I HATE shopping at those big stores! My son came close to having an axiety attack in a K-mart a couple of years ago I had to leave everything in the store and take him out-he turned clammy and sweaty-no, he wasn't ill, just nervous. I rarely take my kids into those stores anyway, but I refuse to do so at holiday time. I do shop at a Dollar General store that is in my town, but its pretty small, and its been there forever-I don't think they knocked anybody out. I don't shop at the Family dollar store though-about the same size, same general type stuff, but its too crowded and the clerks arn't nearly as nice as the D.G. I find I can get just about anything I truly need in my little town-which does NOT have a box store. We also get a fair amount of things mail order, but again, these tend to be from smaller type businesses.

-- Kelly (ksaderholm@yahoo.com), December 18, 2001.

Were any of these small family businesses compensated for their loss?

Mitch, do you REALLY think people who go out of business (thats business) should be paid for doing so? Furthermore should we punish those who are successful?

If we complain that well, the playing field is not level - then who set the playing field?

-- charles (cr@dixienet.com), December 18, 2001.

Dollar General stores and Dollar Tree stores are franchises, therefore I include them in places I shop because they are owned and operated by local people...there are the country mom & pops and the local franchises...except for things like TVs and stoves, etc. which are purchased once in a great while (and not offered by any local stores around here anyway)..again I ask what is it that folks need from the huge giants eating up the landscape as well as the local businesses??? Can someone please explain what they buy at these stores which makes them so necessary?

-- lesley (martchas@bellsouth.net), December 18, 2001.

Lesley, they sell for less, and for people that are on a very limited budget, it helps.

-- Cindy (SE. IN) (atilrthehony@hotmail.com), December 19, 2001.

OK Lesley here goes!! I do shop at K-mart (which has been at our local mall for at least 20 years) and occassionally Wal-mart (about 5 years old here). I buy things like: health supplies (band-aids, antibacterial ointment,vitamins) bird seed for my parakeets, and sometimes a new little toy for them! paper and computer ink, kids school supplies: pens, pencils, tablets, glue, crayons etc... Recently I purchased Christmas gifts like: sleeping bags, videos, fishing tackle box, art supplies, some new Christmas lights. I purchase toilet paper,laundry soap, dish soap, a few cleaning supplies, like if I need a new mop and broom.

We really have no other place to buy these type of things. Our shopping area mostly consists of the mall area, which has literally 100's of stores.

In my small town of 200, there is a gas station, and a small butcher shop with a general grocery store. No one uses the grocery store for their main groceries, as it is easily double what you pay at Aldi's or Even Kroger's. But it is nice to have around if you need little odds and ends. I probably stop there once a week and pick up some little thing. Like yesterday I bought 2 2 liter bottles of sprite for my son;s Christmas Party, and over the wekend I bought the pepperoni for the kids pepperoni rolls. They have a huge selection of lunch meats and cheeses, they make a lot of sandwiches and sell lunch items to local workers and the coal miners.

We do have a Family Dollar and a Dollar General in Barnesville, but that is about 25 miles for me verses 10 to the mall.

I don't like to spend a lot of money, so I generally buy things where I can get the best price. The mall area has been a tremendous boon to our local economy, as that is what our county is trying to promote, the area as a "shopping mecca" They won't be getting rich from me though!!!!!

-- Melissa (me@home.net), December 19, 2001.

Mitch, how can you find fault with Sam Walton's empire that he built from the ground up from nothing? Is't that the Amercan Dream? Freedom to do what you want in life? I wish folks would quit finding fault with folks like Sam Walton and Bill Gates just because they have been so successful, my goodness, what would you want them to do? Fail at their enterprises instead? We have been self-employed at non union jobs our entire lives ( going on 25 years of business now) and wish folks would consider just what life is like making your own way in this country, and having to be competive to survive. You either offer a better product/service for the money, or offer a cheaper product to survive.

Lesley, here where stores are a hour to an hour and a half apart, it only makes sense to shop at a SuperStore where you can make all your purchases at one stop. Also, for majority of items purchased, Wal- mart's prices are unmatchable due to the volume they buy and can pass on to we the consumers.

And, if you are a label reader, you can still buy all American made items, even at Wal-mart!

Frankly, I wish Wal-mart sold gasoline/fuel and cars/ trucks as well, we could use a better deal on new and used vehicles, the auto industry making 25,000 dollars on one vehicle sale is disgusting!!!

-- Annie Miller in SE OH (annie@1st.net), December 19, 2001.

Lesley, like someone else said, frankly WalMart is cheaper than anyone else and they carry more. They are the only store around here that still carries fabrics and they have a good supply of crafts which no one else close to me has. I don't buy my groceries there because I don't care for the quality of most of it. The reason they sell stuff made in China is because we don't make much in this country anymore. I'm against buying Chinese made items but thanks to our former president most of the big companies have moved to other countries. You can go in to some of the most expensive mall stores and still see lots made in China - especially shoes. Try to find a pair of shoes made in the USA. Only a very few companies still make their shoes here. Our local WalMart is always giving things to the schools and to people who have been burned out, etc. They are also one of the few places where people can get a job in this little town.

-- Barb in Ky. (bjconthefarm@yahoo.com), December 19, 2001.

Annie you should send them a letter!! I could just see a "Sam's Car Lot," would probably drive everyone out of business!!!

I can see both sides of the issue. I personally do everything I can to save money and that means I have to get the best deal. Not necessarily the cheapest price, but the lowest price and the best quality I can afford. Like the sleeping bags for instance. My girls go to summer 4-H camp. They wanted new sleeping bags. It is usually hot there, so they didn't need anything for below zero weather. I found them at Wal-mart for $9.97 each. Versus the sporting goods specialty store where they are $35 each. So I can buy 3 for the price of 1. That was an easy choice.

But when it comes time to buy garden plants, I don't get them at K- mart or Wal-mart. I go to the local greenhouse, a 3 generation operation. He grows everything right there, loves to talk about plants,and plants special items by request. I talked him into growing Brandywine tomatoes a few years ago and now they are one of his best-sellers.

So for me personally, I pick and choose which businesses I will support based on a combination of loyalty, prices, quality and need for the item.

-- Melissa (me@home.net), December 19, 2001.

The truth of the matter that Wal Mart is getting too big. What are we going to do when they add dental services, maternity delivery services, truck lines, letter delivery, lawn mowing, mobil home delivery and set up, brick and block laying crews, HVAC contractors, car washes, air lines, battleship groups, nuclear energy plants?

We will live in mud huts and wait for them to lower the moat bridge each morning, we will show our ID's to the guards being glad we can enter the castle again. I will not be alive then for which I am glad.

-- mitch hearn (moopups@citlink.net), December 19, 2001.

I rarely go to Wally World cause I can't breathe in there very long. Gary does most of that kinds of shopping. I do know they have a senior citizen's club or whatever, really gets people involved. I've heard Hillary Clinton's on the board, don't know if that's true or what it matters. I'd much prefer to grow/make/barter my own so I wouldn't have to shop anywhere like that.

-- Cindy (SE. IN) (atilrthehony@hotmail.com), December 19, 2001.

I always shop the second-hand stores 1st. Or check with friends to see if what I need is what they have and don't. Health food stores are my choice for many items - but, alas! W. is cheaper on some supplements, howsomever, they carry only popular items not my picks.

If you can't get it at Walmart - you can't get it. It is that way in too many places.

-- carol (kanogisdi@yahoo.com), December 19, 2001.

Thank you for answering my question about what do you all need to buy at the big stores....Of course if there are no locally owned and operated stores one goes to Walmart. etc...what did folks do before these huge stores came around? I sure hope that little butcher/grocery store is still around in a few years so you will continue to have a choice. I agree with Mitch on this topic..I guess I am old enough to remember when there were nothing but small shops available..we all made out just fine indeed. Small community stores produce a strong sense of "belonging" that one simply does not get when you enter a huge superstore. Personally, I refuse to trade my sense of community for a cheaper product. In the long run, I believe Mitch to be correct that before you know it there will be no local small businesses left, and that will never be a good thing...kind of the same to me as homongous commercial farms swooping in and raising a zillion chickens so that the local farmers couldn't possibly compete with them. I am continually amazed at how folks will get all starry eyed and nostalgic for the "good old days", taking their children to see a working farm modeled after the 1800s, or happily tour a museum dedicated to American craftmanship and they have no clue as they are spending their dollars at Walmart & Kmart, they someday will be visiting a "museum" of the typical old-fashioned family store. What a shame. Can anybody tell I am passionately against these huge stores? LOL.....If this is the future of American business, I am so glad I will be dead before it takes over completely.

-- lesley (martchas@bellsouth.net), December 19, 2001.

I think what people did before the big stores came around, was to travel further. I remember when I was little, before the mall opened, we had to travel about 1 hour to get groceries. My mom had 4 kids and bought 2 weeks worth of stuff at once, rarely going at any other time. When the mall opened with Hills, Krogers, Sears and eventually all the other stores, it saved a lot of people a lot of traveling and a lot of money.

I also notice that in stores like the Dollar Tree, where everything is a dollar, that most everything is not made in the US. I wish it were, but then it would probably not be $1.

We could probably get by without the big stores if we had to, but honestly I am so busy with my kids and activites that there are times I realy appreciate not having to run from place to place.

-- Melissa (me@home.net), December 19, 2001.

Well, I just got home from Wally World and Krogers!!! I will tell you honestly what I bought I could not have bought at any small mom and pop store. Times have changed. Wal Mart has taken the place of the old general store where you had very little to chose from. K Mart is, I believe, an offshoot of the old Kressges dime stores. Where I live the only family owned places here are a drug store, where the prices are double of Wal Mart, a florist who I do occassionaly use, and a hardware store which has a very poor selection and is way too high. My family has had small businesses and I realize they cannot compete with the big guys but that is just the way it is and I wouldn't want to give up the "super" stores to go back to having no selection and paying much more. The big stores do provide jobs for locals so that I think offsets putting out of business the small family owned stores. I do love to buy from Lehman's and I also frequently shop at a MEnnonite bulk food store. When I make it to the "big" town, I go to the co-op health food store. We have only in the past 3 or 4 years had a super Wal Mart available and I am thankful for them. I think the idea that they are going to take over everything is sort of ridiculous.

-- Barb in Ky. (bjconthefarm@yahoo.com), December 19, 2001.

Barb in Ky, you must live way out in the sticks like we do, and I am thankful also that Wal-mart is within a half hour drive now, I can make almost all my purchases in one place, and at a cheap price.

When America starts paying us farmers and truckers a fair price for our goods, I'll start shopping at the higher dollar stores, until then, Wal-mart is all we can afford, and I will make no apologies for shopping there.

-- Annie Miller in SE OH (annie@1st.net), December 20, 2001.

I live in Bentonville Arkansas, home of Wal-Mart. In a town of about 24,000, we have 2 meat markets, 2 non-Wal-Mart grocery stores, three hardware stores, a childrens clothing store, 3 ladies clothing stores, 2 jewelers, etc... Just goes to show you that stores stay open based upon consumer buying and store service. Even here, where 85% of the people are employed by Wal-Mart or one of their vendors, we still support "local" businesses.

-- Ivy in NW AR (balch84@cox-internet.com), December 20, 2001.

The facts remain; small town America is being destroyed. It could not be done by the British, the French, the axis, the nazis, the Japoneeses, the communist; but it is being done by Wal Mart. PERIOD.

-- mitch hearn (moopups@citlink.net), December 20, 2001.

Mitch suggests that all the little mom n' pop stores that went out of business should have been compensated at fair value.

I suggest that they were. You see when a business big or small can no longer compete, then it has no value.

-- Ed Copp (OH) (edcopp@yahoo.com), December 23, 2001.