I live in Virginia and yesterday in New York there was a school shooting that left two children injured. Today in Grundy,at a law school there was a shooting that left 6 injured, and 3 dead (last count). Just because this student was getting a bad grade. I just can't understand this. What is wrong with these people? It makes me scared to send my kids to school.

-- Rita (rlynchjarss@aaol.com), January 16, 2002

Answers

there has been kids that shoot/killed others for their shoes,,or jackets,,or whearing "the wrong color". So,,doing it because of a bad grade surprise you?

-- Stan (sopal@net-port.com), January 16, 2002.

The problem has to do with the fact that there is a certain percentage of kookoo birds in any population. They are also overwhelmingly cowardly. Thanks to your government, they feel pretty invincible, since the odds that they will encounter anyone who can fight back (read armed, ie. carrying a firearm) is miniscule. Especially in a school zone. The answer is not "gun control". Better to allow responsible citizens to carry the means to resist these law breakers, and take them out, incidentally saving the taxpayers millions in apprehension, trials, and incarceration. We have become too much touchy-feely, willing to blame society rather than the perp, and too willing to blame anybody but the miscreant. I am armed as I write this. Anybody else? GL!

-- Brad (homefixer@SacoRiver.net), January 16, 2002.

First that is ONE of the reasons we started homeschooling 5 years.But, IMHO I think alot of it has to do with the fact that kids today (as well as some adults) are given everything they want and then when something goes wrong the only way they know how to handle it is with violence. Because that is what they see in all the video games they are given. No I am not totally blaming video games or TV but it seems that alot of people of all ages have lost touch with reality.

-- Lou Ann in KY (homes_cool@msn.com), January 16, 2002.

prozac, zoloft, paxil, luvox, effexor, serzone, anafranil, fen-phen, redux, ritalin?

-- B. Lackie (cwrench@hotmail.com), January 16, 2002.

I think they should be treated as terrorist, They are nothing more than that. I personally do not believe that just because they get a "bad grade" or they have a "problem" with someone, they can get off. I don't believe in profiling, but I am tired of seeing innocent kids (and adults) being murdered. I believe that "Big Brother" already has enough intrusion in our lives, but we as a society must put a stop to this type of behavior. enough is enough, it's time for the American People to take a stand.

-- Rita (rlynchjarss@aol.com), January 16, 2002.

How about single parent homes , no dad involed if they even know him , no responsiblity ,no daily chores , shall I continue?

-- Patty {NY State} (fodfarms@hotmail.com), January 16, 2002.

Before this turns into a gun control debate, to put it mildly, let me give notice at that point this thread will probably be deleted if it does so. It can carried over to one of the off-shoot forums.

-- Ken S. in WC TN (scharabo@aol.com), January 16, 2002.

In my opinion, the problem has many causes. We can't blame single parents, etc. There are a lot of children that are not being raised with the values that we "older" people were. Blame it on society..I don't know! All we can do is try our best to be a positive influence on young people so they will understand that someone cares.

-- Ardie /WI (ardie54965@hotmail.com), January 16, 2002.

Good for you Ardie .By single parents I did not mean the ones who care , it was the ones who maybe don't know who the father is .Or a Dad who could care less about his kids , or the mom who has 20 diffrent dates a week but no time to play cards with the kids.

-- Patty {NY State} (fodfarms@hotmail.com), January 16, 2002.

Ardie, Just to let you know, last year in a community of ~3000 (that I reside in) a child (14 year old) brought his father's gun on our school bus. The school's reaction was to set up a time, once a month, for these "students" to come in and "vent" their concerns. As of this day, I still see kids standing on the side of the road, looking for trouble.

Rita

-- Rita (rlynchjarss@aol.com), January 16, 2002.

First of all, that is a big reason I homeschool.

Secondly, the system has it set up that if you discipline your children, DSS gets involved, and has in some cases taken children out of a good home situation because (IMO) they have overstepped their bounds. While at the same time, when something happens like this, the parents are pointed at for not disciplining their kids.

The way I see it is society has taken parental authority away, and many kids therefore have no respect for any authority, on earth as well as elsewhere.

One of the best things we can do, IMO, is to teach children to work, through chores early on that are age appropriate, and later on through work that can earn a little money for themselves.

I agree that many children are given too much, and are expected to contribute too little. But how do we go about training them, without DSS (division of social services) involving themselves to the hindrance of the family? I realize there are some cases where this intervention is needed, I just think they've gone way too far the other way.

Does anyone else feel this way?

-- Sandie in Maine (peqbear@maine.rr.com), January 16, 2002.

I grew up in a fairly small town, and I can remember many occassions when a school friend or teammate went home at the end of the day and got "busted" by his/her parents for an infraction which had been reported by a neighbor, a member of the church, or some other adult in the community who might have witnessed what they considered to be misbehavior. I should add here that we were all pretty good kids- all college-prep and on the honor roll at school, all involved in sports, 4-H/FFA, many also involved in church programs, and we ALL had part- time jobs because our parents held the common belief that kids should not be spoiled and should learn firsthand the value of a good strong work ethic!!! So, an "infraction" could have been something like squealing one's tires, even inadvertantly, while pulling out of a parking lot; or, being caught smoking a cigarette (which most of us didn't even do because we were athletes anyway), or hanging around with someone deemed unsuitable. I guess the worst thing we could do was to show disrespect for an adult. Any of the above would result in swift and severe punishment. And, being from the South as I am, I can remember teachers paddling the students as punishment in school. I can also recall instances where an unrelated adult took steps to correct misbehavior, and that those efforts, when reported to the offending child's parents, were usually appreciated. In those days, none of our parents would have conceived of filing lawsuits, and instead of blaming the adult, would have looked to their own kids to find out why we were causing trouble. It seems as if these days parents, and society in general, are way too permissive, and kids are accustomed to having their own way with no regard for the consequences of their actions. As a result, they grow up not knowing how to cope when they don't get their way.

And another thing- in my time, if a group of kids had a beef with each other, or another group of kids, it would usually get settled out in the woods, without benefit of the watchful eye of teachers, parents, clergy, or law enforcement. This allowed kids to vent their frustrations in a physical way, with fists, as opposed to knives, bombs, guns, etc. Usually no one was badly hurt, and once it was over the kids were usually friends again within a few days. Now, if a kid gets into a fistfight after school, he could go to jail, which seems a bit extreme to me.

Additionally, when we were growing up, every kid in my neighborhood (boys and girls), owned at least a couple of firearms, usually a .22 rifle and a small-bore shotgun (.410 or 20 gauge). None of us hunted, by the way, we were just gun crazy kids. We would collect soda bottles for refunds and save our nickles and dimes until we had the purchase price of a new firearm, at which point one of our parents would take us down to the store and make the purchase. We mostly shot cans, targets, and clay pigeons. Our parents did not hunt, either, but all of us kids were schooled in gun safety before we were turned loose with our weapons, and we all had a healthy respect for them. In high school, my best friend and I were even on the school rifle team- I wonder if such a thing exists anymore? Point being, that none of us would have dreamed of using a gun against anyone else.

Now that I am all wound up about this, I will yield the floor, lol.

-- Elizabeth (ekfla@aol.com), January 16, 2002.

I really think that there are just to many parents that for one reason or another just can't or won't raise their children to have just the basic respect and manners needed. Lots of people just have no hope and place no value on life.

Plus the penalties just aren't severe enough and the appeal process takes way to long.

-- Sean (sean27@attbroadband.com), January 16, 2002.

There should always be other options than fighting (except in self- defense) to settle differences, although I am not impressed with the peer intervention programs, because I feel that adults should be dealing with these issues, not other children who haven't a clue.

My father used to shake his head when he heard the term "peer group" anyway, because he said it demeaned the original sense of the word "peer". When someone was made a peer (like in Britain), it was because you usually (although I am sure there were exceptions) accomplished something pretty special, not that you breathed in and out enough times to get to be a certain age.

Today's kids who bully really want to hurt someone, there was one case of a kid practically beaten senseless on a bus (caught on camera) and the driver didn't interfere because of some regulation preventing them from touching children for any reason (gee, would this also apply to pulling them out of a wrecked and burning bus? I shudder to think). What is worse was that not only did the bully have problems elsewhere prior to this incident, he was transferred to another school with no record of this latest incident. Why isn't he in juvenile hall? I never really saw or heard of the type of fighting that Elizabeth speaks of-- if you did any fighting, you were probably behaving in other unsuitable ways as well.

I know Rita was posting on the latest school shooting, but does that mean people won't go to work either? Just a thought.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), January 16, 2002.

And people criticize home schoolers!! You have got to be kidding!! I would be home schooling my Kids if I were starting out. Man people get real here. Your arrested if you discipline your chilern and then criticized if you don't. What is a parent to do?! We live in an insane society and who is to blame? Big brother for taking our rights away from us one at a time. I hate having to vote for the person I think will do the least amount of damage to what rights we have left!!

-- Nancy (gndonley@hotmail.com), January 16, 2002.

Until we do to these people what they have done to others this will continue.

-- fred (fred@mddc.com), January 16, 2002.

Rita, My opinion on the matter is the destruction of the family unit. the parents both work and while it means the home is very nice with lots of nice clothes and toys and games and plenty of eating out, there is little time spent as a family, doing things together, not just fun stuff but needed work around the home and there used to be extended family members, grandparents and aunts and uncles and cousins. there was a sense of belonging and being part of a larger group of people who loved you. that is the great sadness to me, most of these kids feel completely adrift from any and everyone. I'm off my soapbox now and so glad i had the chance to have all those things when I was a kid.

-- Karen in Kansas (kansashobbit@yahoo.com), January 16, 2002.

1) Kids are starting in at day care younger and younger, meaning they are being raised by strangers who don't truly have their best at stake.

2) when raised in daycare, or in school all the time, the peer group becomes more important than the family values. Family doesn't/shouldn't mock and taunt them all the time: peers at school do.

3) Kids spend way too much time in front of tv, watching movies and playing on the computer

4) they are bombarded by negative media images that should just be ABOLISHED. How many times a day are we as adults confronted with cleavage, sex, violence, alcohol, etc....just in advertising and magazine covers as we are in stores?

5) they often have parents who don't want to parent in the first place and could care less....my birth mother actually used to buy my brother and sister booze (she didn't raise me) but thought "pot" was my brother's downfall and sent him to rehab for it... Get the picture? they don't punish (drives me nuts that my so many parents I know don't enforce "NO" and try to discuss things with kids too young to reason!)

6) We are a moralless society. And, I believe MORALS cross all categories and religions when it comes to bringing kids up. Some of the best moms I've known were single, but are raising their kids to be good, kind, and OBEDIENT, RESPECTFUL children....

One of the bejillion reasons I homeschool.

-- marcee (thathope@mwt.net), January 16, 2002.

What's the matter Brad - think your computer is going to shoot you? The attitude that pointing a gun at a problem will fix everything is exactly why so many kids and postal workers are "taking out" their fellow students and workers.

-- Deborah Stephenson (wonkaandgypsy@hotmail.com), January 16, 2002.

Brad: Please explain the '"your government" commment'

-- Kathy (catfish201@hotmail.com), January 16, 2002.

My .02 for what it's worth..

I have read this thread and I read the thread that george started about customer service skills. I see similarities.

And I see a lot of problems and I don't know what the answer is.

I will remind people that things were not Norman Rockwellish 10, 20, 30 years ago. There have always been problems. I just finished 'The Orphan Trains'. It is a history of the various foster type programs in the US. The book is focused on the turn of the century [the last one] and it was not a pretty picture.

I don't think that having guns or not having them has any impact on the general public's feeling of lack of civil control.

I don't think that home schooling or public schooling or private schooling has any grand impact.

I don't think there are any less fully functioning families than there were in the past. With the advent of easier divorce, many women and children have been able to escape abuse. This used to be a hidden burden [and still is to a great extent] of American women.

I do believe that many people forget the common courtesies these days. The 'yes maams, thank you sirs, pleases and after yous' have somehow faded from our lexicon.

But, I'm not sure that I am willing to agree that things are worse compared to when I was a cricket. Even Socrates lamented about the degeneration of society and the willfulness of youth.

My motto? I am but a mere speck but I still must tread lightly. Nothing revolves around me in the big picture. I must be gentle with all that the world hands me. Plant, animal, mineral. I try.

-- pc (pc@pc.com), January 16, 2002.

Hay brad its handy. Bob se,ks.

-- Bobco (bobco@kans.com), January 16, 2002.

It's such a shame that we as a society have become such big wimps. Everyone always says fist fights are so wrong, why? Countries settle differences by force and might why not youngsters. TOday students in schools have no reliable course to take to combat any sort of teasing or bullying. THe teachers and administrators as a whole (there are exceptions) turn a blind eye to the transgressions of the atheletes and polictical ingroup children. WE teach children force and violence are wrong and that trusting in the system will take care of you. IT DOESN'T. I graduated in 2000 and the bull**** I saw take place in my school system virtually sickened me. Schools play games with students; they take those students who somehow despite teaching have intelligence and grandstand them by showing the world what the school's dedicated faculty and staff created. Atheletes are held back, or passed through classes without meeting standards, and when they graduate they can't get into colleges or certain programs because they are unable to meet minimum scores. A former starting quarter back for my school now works in a factory because he could never score he wanted to be teacher. THe basic student is facing a system that doesn't work and has no desire to fix itself. They are alone and on their own, people turn to violence because what other avenue to they have, and for that matter what do they have to lose.

-- aw (possumdog@yahoo.com), January 16, 2002.

Don't you remember? The absolute terror of a bad grade. Perhaps an overbearing parent who always wanted you to be a lawyer, or a doctor or such. The intense pressure of making the grade? Law school is intense and the pressures are very real. I by no means condone the situation, I am merely asking that we imagine, for a moment, the heavy weight of parents expectations, of professor's condescensions, of classmates jabs and the everpresent requirements of hundreds of pages of reading every night...a bad grade in law school is no different than being fired from your only job after years and years...what else is there? Violence is never the answer, but if one is disassociated from reality by TV violence and desperation...it is not so hard to understand the urge. I guess the most important thing I try to teach my children is that bad urges are natural and healthy, but controlling them is what makes us civilized.

-- gilly (wayoutfarm@skybest.com), January 16, 2002.

Sandi,

I agree with you!!

-- Terry - NW Ohio (aunt_tm@hotmail.com), January 16, 2002.

I'd like to address this to 'aw'

The universe really does not revolve around certain people. Go back to your school ten years from now. You will see what I mean.

Sure. I still remember the bully in first grade. And I am forty something. But I remember they they were wacko.

Rise above the nonsense. No matter what your age. Find your calling and go for it..

-- pc (pc@pc.com), January 16, 2002.

I was a kid who came from a 2 parent home. I had ok looks, though nothing in particular. I was shy and generally standoffish. And I was quite nearly another one to kill a classmate over relatively trivial matters. I can identify with those kids who do what they do. Cowardly, maybe. Here the true story in breif: everything was ok until I hit 5th grade and entered a Middle school. By 6th grade, I had had my hair plugged with chewing gum every day by the school bus bully. I had been locked for 2 hours in a locker. I had been beat up numerous times. In that 6th grade year a kid decided to with the help of a few others- beat me up. He wound up hitting me in the back of the head and knocking me (bloody) unconsious. Took the teacher 45 minutes to find me- no one in the entire class bothered to tell the tacher I was lying in the back of the classroom. My mother removed me from that school and placed me in private (catholic) school, small class, etc. I was now the outsider in a school where everyone knew everyone from grade 1 and was terribly picked on. 2 days before grasduation I was beaten up by the boys segment of the class so severly I literally crawled home. I remember them now, boys I knew for 2 years now, spitting hockers at me and kicking me in the ribs. No teachers "noticed" that I had left for the day... ANd then it was on to high school. My first ninth grade year was awful. Some punk came up with the untrue rumor that I had done vile things to a cat, and they actually wrote songs about my exploits there off. I wanted to run away from home. Home life was ok, but I space cadeted to escape reality... i would run away from home to the hills and forests and know how to survive (in fact this dream is most likey the only reason I did live through HS- I thought of suicide many times, but that dream kept me alive. My second 9 th grade year came, and from day one, I had learned a valuable lesson. You had to beat people up to make them respect you. I fought all damn year long, even to the point that when a senior beat me up fiercly ( he was line backer on football team and weighed inat 200 plus, to my 120), I planned to kill him and packed a knife. He got wind of it and apologized to me. And there were all kinds of other episodes of sheer cruelty. Looking back, I was wrong on somethings, but I was pushed over the edge- these "normal" kids in the usa today are violent, abusive and know any number ways to be cruel. Im not supporting shooting your class mate, but at least identify with the shooter (in somecases). And... You HAD BETTER believe I am for homeschooling- the public and private school systems dont work for 50 percent of the population. After I learned how to beat other kids up and the rest of the kids learned that I had planned to kill that senior, they let off the pick mode- and I was a normal kid by senior year. But I shouldnt have had to resort to their standards (violence to the extreem) to "fit in"!

-- ohgodiwasthereonce (Notthistime@dontemail.com), January 16, 2002.

Probably some of you might disagree with me on this but here goes....I feel that since the taking of prayer out of schools things have went down hill for public schools. Those few minutes of the Lord's prayer or "meditation" as we called it in the 60's seemed to make you realize that there was a God who was in control and you respected life in general. Another not popular opinion of mine is the rise in abortions....touchie subject here I realize again. But...no respect for human life so why should we expect children to respect each other. Plus todays society doesn't teach children and adults to be responsible for their actions. It's because your mother or father did something to you that has caused you to be the bad person you are today...excuses not responsiblity. I truly understand that many, many people have had terrible upbringing as children, I know one personally, but they didn't go rob a bank or kill their nieghbors because of that. The respect for human life and animals too is not being taught or even shown children of today. Until todays society goes back to being responsible for their own actions and taking the punishment for wrong actions what can we expect of the younger generation. I too believe that government has too much involvement in families as well. I'm not talking about the warranted actions with abused children or the elderly, I believe we all agree with this. I can remember still till today being turned over my Father's knee at 14 years old !!! for talking back to him. Even today I still wouldn't think of being disrespectful !! Today that would probably be considered child abuse...get a grip here !!! But how many of us would stop and help someone or a child or an animal for that fact that was being abused ?? Would we call the local sheriff if thought something was wrong or wouldn't we want to "get involved"? I believe we are our "brothers keeper" to a degree. Until we teach that you are responsible for what you do and there is punishment involved what can we expect !!

-- Helena (windyacs@npacc.net), January 17, 2002.

ogodiwasthereonce,

you have summed up the underlying evil I felt and saw in school TWENTY years ago. I managed to stay in the back ground and out of sight of the wolves for the most part. I decided that they could not have mine and my kids are homeschooled. But that doesn't protect them . We still have to deal with it at the local youth center in the locker rooms when we go swimming and after CHURCH in the "youth room". My boys have had to learn to handle themselves. People think that i am nuts and that your situation doesn't occur very often. They are wrong. It happens on every bus, locker room, public restroom, hallway corner, stairwell, and back of classroom with an unattentive or overworked teacher. We have reached the point where children have hearts that are calloused and parents are in denial or think that it is normal. Do I have a solution??? Only in my own home for now. Someday my kids will leave me and this safe place and I hope that I have prepared them. Does it scare me? Yes---SPITLESS.

-- Tana Mc (mcfarm@totelcsi.net), January 17, 2002.

I see people extolling the virtues of corporal punishment. I see people extoll the virtues of home schooling.

How are children supposed to learn cooperation when these things comingle?

Devils advocate..

-- pc (pc@pc.com), January 17, 2002.

I teach in a middle school. By far all kids are just kids. They have hearts and feelings too. Demographically speaking, I work in a diverse rural division. If adults, meaning not just parents, take time to listen, care, and remember what it was like to be young, it helps. Of course there are always "bad seeds", but even they have good in them, we need to look for it and recognize it, and acknowledge it. I would never homeschool, my personal beliefs are that kids need socialization and are eventually going to work in the public, and need to know how to deal with it. But, if you home school that is fine, that is JUST my opinion.

-- julie britt (jbritt@ceva.net), January 17, 2002.

i think alot of it has to do with the media. they prey, yes prey on the kids and try to sell them any and everything. to be hip, do this, act this way. parents are helpless because the media does such a good job of infiltrating their minds and brainwashing them. it didnt use to be this way. kids on the west coast didnt know what the kids in the east were doing. now, they even see the news at school on a cable network, and advertisers put their two cents in there too.

-- js (schlicker54@aol.com), January 17, 2002.

For the most part, kids that homeschool have more socialization, and better socialization skills than those that go to organized schools. This has been demonstrated time and again. When was the last time you worked with 20 or more people all the same age as you? The socialization issue is dwelt on by school officials due for the most part by the fact that the home educated kids are far exceeding their schooled peers in virtually all areas. They have nothing else by which to degrade the ever escalating ranks of homeschooling families. By the way the most rapidly rising segment of people turning to home education right now are professionally trained teachers.

For some students who have been singled out to be beat up in school, home education can be their only way to an education. I will not be surprised if public school gets phased out and distance learning high school takes it's place. Many charter schools have registered as online schools at this point.

I, for one, am very happy the home education avenue is there.

-- Sandie in Maine (peqbear@maine.rr.com), January 17, 2002.

So, a computer can replace all I do in one day? It can understand and console a student who is having problems at home? It can lend lunch money to a kid who is without? It can be a role model in which the student can learn how to be a good citizen? It can pat a child on the back when they do a good job? It can cry when a child cries? Or maybe a computer professional can have a calling in which it perceives teaching as work for God. Maybe I went to school for nothing.

-- julie britt (jbritt@ceva.net), January 17, 2002.

It will not kill someone in this country to go without lunch one day because they forgot their money. Along those lines: I once declined a spelling bee to go on a field trip. I forgot to bring the money for the field trip, so didn't go (and didn't participate in the spelling bee either. The instructor asked me why I hadn't borrowed the money from him, and I explained that it was my fault, which it was, and it would not be right to borrow from him for my goof. That was that.

Homeschooling with a computer is just another tool. Public schools are bad mostly because of discipline problems. Maybe children shouldn't be allowed around other children UNLESS they can behave. Wow, what a concept. This would make it a lot easier for teachers, and they could do their jobs instead of trolling for parent volunteers (my opinion is that if things are so bad at school that you feel the need to volunteer, pull your child (your first responsibility, not other people's kids, I don't hold with the "It takes a village" theory except for children without parents or relatives) out and homeschool).

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), January 17, 2002.

I'm agreeing with what Marcee said, and adding that if our society had the policy of "an eye for an eye" instantly, that this would make allot of people think twice before allowing themselves to be put in these situations.

-- Harmony (harmonyfarm57@hotmail.com), January 17, 2002.

We live in a small rural community with a parochial school that has about 50 students, preschool through 8th grade. What I see here is a lot of accountability(sp?) If a child meeses up, not only does he/she have to answer to it's parents, but it's grandparents,uncles, aunts, cousins and all the other grandparents who hear about it on the "Grandma network", as I call it. There are no secrets. I think that keeps the kids on the straight and narrow.

-- Ardie/WI (ardie54965@hotmail.com), January 17, 2002.

My husband is a 5th grade teacher. The other day one of his students and his father came in and requested that my husband spend an hour after school with this child because he needed a "positive male role model" Go figure, you would think that this father would be embarassed to even ask this? Nope, it didn't even cross his mind that it was supposed to be him. Cara

-- cara lewis (moomaine@hotmail.com), January 17, 2002.

Oh cara, how sad!

-- Ardie/WI (ardie54965@hotmail.com), January 17, 2002.

Kathy, I must first declare that I am a Libertatian, to wit, the smaller and less oppressive the government is, the better. I see a need for certain responsibilities that the Feds should use our tax money to subsidize. Defense Dept., Interstate Highways, and certain other responsibilities that are beyond the abilities of the state to accomplish either individually or in consanance. But there are many very wasteful things that cost us all more of OUR money than is necessary, and they are mostly Socialist/Communist programs. For instance, why do we have a Department of Education? Is that somehow beyond local intelligence? I think not - it is merely a bureaucratic overlay that costs, and does not pay. Social Security (a worse investment than Enron!), Food Stamps, Aid to Families with Dependent Children, Farm subsidies (money for large corporations,not the "family farm"), swimming lessons for Ted Kennedy, or new highways for West Virginia, are all a waste of OUR money! I can remember the days when folks took care of their own. No brag, just fact - we (that'd be Maggie and I) have taken in kids whose parents were too full of themselves to care about the kids. No pay from the state, no remuneration from the useless parents. But we had enough to share, and those kids got a grip on life just because we cared! You can always add another cup of water to the soup to care for one more! And Ken - get a life! The 2nd Amendment is perhaps the most important of the lot. Do away with that one, and all of the others will soon follow. GL! But don't get stupid!

-- Brad (homefixer@SacoRiver.net), January 17, 2002.

Rita, We reap what we sew. We grow our kids in our back yard in this "rush to ritches" society, harden them in school, try to find time to talk to them, and seldom have time to listen.

-- woodsbilly (coleenl@penn.com), January 17, 2002.

Has anyone here looked into the Indigo's? These are folks, mostly kids under 10, that are supposedly a new breed of human beings. According to the write ups, the kids that have killed in schools are Indigo children. Most people see them as problem kids, drugging them up to contain them. I really recommend researching this. I've only began a couple of months ago because our son shows signs of this new breed. He's not violent or anything like that but you must be aware of Indigos in order to understand them. With the little research I've done so far, it's really helped in the raising of our son.

-- David Nixon (arfg@rkymtnhi.com), January 18, 2002.

Mr. Nixon, please define whatever you are talking about. Another label for children? And why are they being drugged? Oy vey!

-- Ardie /WI (ardie54965@hotmail.com), January 18, 2002.

Indigo children are superior little beings that are so far advanced compared to us normal folks that they deserve to be called a new breed of human, at least that's how they appear to their parents, unfortunately those of us who dont have adequate meta-physical observational capabilities can only see them as spoiled, selfish little sh#ts!

-- john hill (john@cnd.co.nz), January 18, 2002.

The answer to this lies in a billion places but the start of all of it is at home. There is a reason the Lord established the family. When the family goes abnormal, the results are also abnormal. Such as kids resolving their differences with guns.(Why aren't they being educated on guns by their parent? Because the homes are not functioning. We must also ask ourselves about the value of life. What are we teaching our children about the value of another human when we kill so many babies in this country? Life is not worth much anymore. Sometimes, even their own isn't worth much (ie teen suicide.) But, where are the moms and dads? Why aren't the moms there to help these kids? I also have to ask myself how a mom can send her children off to public school with the odds as they are???? (Obviously, mine are homeschooled and would be even if I had to sell all that I own to be able to do it!)

Also, while I would be closer to a Constitutional party supporter than a Liberatarian(sp?) I agree with Brad on lots of issues about Big Brother having FAR TOO MUCH POWER AND MONEY! Come on people, we need to wake up and realize they are slipping our rights out from under our noses! When you lose the right to bear arms, (BTW THIS IS A GOD GIVEN RIGHT THAT MAN CAN'T TAKE AWAY)what can you do to stop anything they want to do to ("for") you? Study about Hitler and the Jews! Interesting sidenote: The new DL in Texas say (since Sept. 11) at the top"Drivers License/Identification card". Nice to know they are already starting with National Id.....

-- Connie (trying2bselfsufficient@yahoo.com), January 18, 2002.