29th Anniversary of Roe v Wade

greenspun.com : LUSENET : Freedom! self reliance : One Thread

Today is a sad day in the history of the United States. It was 29 years, and millions of babies ago, that the Supreme Court decided that the mother had the "right" to kill her unborn child.

I have thought of this with sadness many times, but felt helpless. I just can't understand how a mother would voluntarily kill her child. It goes against everthing that I believe a mother to be.

I hope that you will think about this and do what you can to stop this atrocity immediately. Thank you from all the little lost ones.

Talk to you later.

-- Bob in WI (bjwick@hotmail.com), January 22, 2002


I think there needs to be:

1. More and easier ways to either drop a newborn at a hospital with NO negative repercussions on the mother provided the baby is healthy;

2. Repealment of laws allowing adoptees to find out about their birth parents, if the parent giving the baby up had originally given up the baby under the impression either by law or by an adoption agency that he/she (there ARE two parents involved here, whether people admit it or not) could NEVER be contacted regarding this baby, regardless of the reason. If the parent wishes to waive that right later and conduct a search they are welcome to post to some clearinghouse board or whatever, but they should not have their right to privacy taken away.

With today's health insurers looking for ANY way to disqualify you from getting health insurance, it would probably behoove one NOT to find out their family's medical history (not to mention I think finding out that there is a history of "whatever" can get you into a self-fulfilling prophecy mode, and you worry yourself into getting something, imho).

3. Better barrier (so that babies in the earliest stages of life aren't killed) methods of birth control need to be found, also. If companies can make viagara, they can address this problem too.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), January 22, 2002.

How about some self-control/morals? Teaching abstainance and easier adoptions.

-- Cindy (SE. IN) (atilrthehony@hotmail.com), January 22, 2002.

Another issue is making sure that men are equally involved. It is completely unfair to put all the blame on the mother. It took two to make that baby.

How many men force women (through intimidation, violence, or other means) into having an abortion? How many men refuse to have vasectomies because of stupid male pride, and don't care how many children their poor wives have? It is a much less risky operation for men than it is for women.

It should also be easier to adopt. I have no problem with some background checking, but please try to remember that bearing a child does not automatically make you a fit parent. Another thing: I watched something awhile back where someone was complaining about children of one race being adopted by parents of another. Gee, do you think the children would be better off in orphanages? What a thought!

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), January 22, 2002.

I agree with everything/ but not being able to find your birth parents--- My hubby was adopted in a closed record state----Mo.

Five years ago /he found his bith family----it was the best thing in our lives as well as theirs---- We only wanted to find medical facts as hubby was haveing great medical problems---when we found the family after 25 years of searching--it was sooo wonderful to have medical history /for my hubby as well as his children!!!!! Also the family /that did know about him /had been sarching for him for over 50 years!!! Unless you have been there--as the one who has "no history"---& about 10--million other reasons----you can't judge I don't believe!!! Unless you are the one in those shoes!!

If it were not for adoption-- I would not have a husband & children & grandchildren!!!!! I praise God my husband's Mother choose adoption!!! Instead of abortion!!!! As I would not have the family I do!!!!

-- Sonda (sgbruce@birch.net), January 22, 2002.

But Sonda, what about people who for whatever reason, do not want to be found?

For every story that has a happy ending like yours, there are many others that don't end so happily--would you want to know that the child you gave up for adoption was on death row (or conversely, an adopted child find out that the parent was)?

What about someone who has finally comes to terms with giving that baby up for adoption 20 years ago, and has a husband, other children and so forth, only to have someone come knocking on the door disrupting their lives as well as the birth monther's? What if the baby was the child of rape or incest? If you had given up a baby under those circumstances, would you want to see them again, particularly if they bore a marked physical resemblance to your attacker/abuser? Not me.

Also, the medical history reasons to find birth parents will go by the wayside as genetic mapping becomes more commonplace. I can't imagine ever wanting to know my family's medical history that badly--I mean, what can you do about it except obsess over it?

I repeat, I have no problems with parents CHOOSING to be found (it should be the parent's choice), but I don't think that adopted children should have the "right" to find their birth parents, for any reason. That fear (that the child will find the parent someday, somehow) is why many don't give up babies for adoption through normal channels anymore, or do the dump and run, or worse, have an abortion.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), January 22, 2002.

There are so many dichotomies in the abortion issue debates it makes my head spin at times......an unmarried woman who becomes pregnant makes a choice to abort the baby and the father of the baby has no voice in the matter at all..none. Same woman decides to keep the baby and the father is dragged to court and forced to pay support for a child he doesn't want, because he IS the father and "bears" responsibility..that's garbage, IMHO....a pregnant woman at 30 weeks is walking down the street and gets whacked by a mugger..she is taken to the hospital where the baby is delivered and subsequently dies. Because the baby took a single breath, the mugger is charged with second degree murder in the commission of a crime..same woman continues her walk, sans mugging,to the hospital and has a legal third trimester abortion and is charged with nothing at all. Does this defy common sense or what? It appears that even the laws do not reflect the same standards of respect or lack of it for unborn babies. Suppose a girl of 13 is raped and becomes pregant (that's a common argument for abortion)...should the law mandate that she alone is allowed to choose to kill this unwanted child before it is born? If so, what about the 13 year old girl who becomes pregnant on her own and after the baby is a week old, gets angry at it and kills it? Should she be charged with murder or merely changing her mind? When I was a young nurse in my 20s, before it was possible to save babies who were born severely premature at 28 weeks....I used to work in the ER of a huge city hospital. Women would come in having miscarriages and deliver a 28 or 30 weeker on the stretcher...These little guys were fearfully and wonderfully made indeed, and it was so hard to sit there and hold them in a tiny blanket while we waited for them to die. I have seen aborted kids at the same gestational age as well..they are not supposed to be "born alive" but they sure do it often enough to make a person ill. I gave up a rather lucrative job in protest. I do not have the solution that everybody would like..there is no easy answer..yet I wonder how things would be if it were easier to adopt unwanted kids..many of us anti-abortion folks would adopt these children in a minute..but we do not meet the requirements! Too old, not enough money, the baby wouldn't be able to be sent to Harvard later on, ad nauseum....when folks COULD adopt kids more easily, there were tons of kids with families...sigh...human life is much less sacred now than it ever was, and the numbers of abortions prove it..makes me quite sad.

-- lesley (martchas@bellsouth.net), January 22, 2002.

I just finished watching Alan Keyes and his new show. He had on Dr. James Dobson. The topic was abortion. It was a very interesting discussion. One thing stuck in my mind was when Dr Dobson said that it is illegal to destroy an eagle egg ($50000 fine), but it is not illegal to kill an unborn child. Why is a preborn eagle of greater value than a preborn child? The eagle has not been born, therefore it can't really be an eagle. Why should there be a penalty for destroying the egg?

Talk to you later.

-- Bob in WI (bjwick@hotmail.com), January 23, 2002.

My hubby was born in a hospital for unwed Mothers in Mo. his birth mother was forced to give him up for adoption---by her parents & Mo is a closed record state---- My hubby found his birth family about 5 years ago now----after we had searched for almost 20 years. We also found his birth mother was dead & so was his birth father---- but we met his 2 half brothers & 1 half sister & his aunt (who also had been searching for him for over 50 years). When hubby's birth Mother became pregant she was forced by her parents to give my hubby up for adoption-& told she could not marry the man she loved & the father of her child----- So she gave him up for adoption & her parents forced her to marry the man they wanted her to marry---she had two children by this man-- before they dicorced & one child died--- She later married the man she had always loved & was the father of her first child/ she was forced to put up for adoption /& she had two more children by this man--- They always wanted to find "their Son"--also a sister of this woman & her hubby could not have children & had searched to find the child put up for adoption /as they didn't know if he was in a home or still in an orphanage--or what---as it was a closed record state--- My hubby was adopted by a man & woman that were over 40 years old & who truely bought him / as they had been turned down by everyone else ---they had bought a girl about 2 years before this---- My hubby was told everyday of his life that/he was an adopted & he should kiss their feet for giving "a bastard child" a home---- to say /he had an unhappy, upbringing would be an understatement!!!

When my hubby found his birth family----it filled in all the gaps he had in his life---he actually was a different person!!!!!!! His whole way of life changed & how he looked at everything in his whole life! Finding "his roots" was like finding himself finally for the first time in his life! It answered questions & many problems he had delt with--- also when his children & my hubby fill out any reports /also on health /they finally have answers!!! More answers to more questions that anyome would dream we had-- I know there are some cases in which incest & other things have happened---but we work with many adult adoptive groups & I can honestly say----those who have found birth family----99.9 % have turned out to be answers to far more questions & life problems than medical histories-- Some don't continue to have contact just needed answers--- My hubby's experirnce has worked out to where we can drive several hours & decorate his birth-parents graves & he talks on the phone every week to his brother--we see each other as much as possible- I e-mail his family every day of the week--- unless you have been there & it has been your life--there is no way /I can explain it!! Nor do I expect to change any one's mind-- only possibly people see there are more than one side to everything-- in the rule of adoption--- & finding birth family--- Again---I praise God everyday that my birth Mother-in-law choose adoption over abortion. She had no choice in giving up her child/ & later the father & her were able to finally get together as it should have been --if her parents had not been abusive----and insisited she was to marry another man-- it is just a shame---they were not premitted to have their child & get married---as many people suffered because her parents lived the lives of their children in this case!! A family adopted a son to have someone to care for them----& my hubby & I did just that---to the very end---with Christain love--(that his adopted parents never would come to know God). But I think our rewards /have been being able to find his birth family who love us!!! I don't expect to change anyone's mind---but for some /to see it is easy to judge if you don't know us-or our lives & where we have been & where we are now!! It was a true miracle we found our birth family & I praise God we have them!!! We are totaly supporters of PRO-LIFE----& the story of the fine for an Eagle's egg & what happens to our precious unborn children every minute of the day---- There was an abortion doctor in Wichita who was giveing FREE abortions in celebration of the anniversary of Roe v. Wade--it just breaks my heart----I'm setting here crying as I type that-- It makes me wonder /how many of our precious children died today/ FREE to their Mothers-- because he wanted to celebrate!!!! They will pay some day---if it wasn't today/ probably in more ways than I will ever understand!!!! Thank you for listening to me ramble tonight---

-- Sonda (sgbruce@birch.net), January 23, 2002.

Here is an article that addresses a very common pro-choice argument.

Here is another good article on this subject.

-- chuck in md (woah@mission4me.com), January 23, 2002.

Sonda, I have a nephew who is adopted and we are so thankful every day that we have him. I cannot imagine telling a child they should be grateful and "kiss the feet" of their parents for saving them from death, terrible other life, etc. I think that my nephew was a godsend and he did more "saving" of his parents than vice-versa.

-- Christine in OK (cljford@mmcable.com), January 23, 2002.

Jeremiah 1:5 "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, and before you were born I consecrated you."

Psalm 139: 13-14 "You formed my inmost being; you knit me in my mother's womb. I praise you, so wonderfully you made me; wonderful are your works!"

-- vicki in NW OH (thga76@aol.com), January 23, 2002.

Here's an Addy for an editorial by Joesph Farah regarding the Constitutional issues about Roe Vs. Wade. Short and interesting. The first paragraph (or 2)has a rant like edge to it. Work past that to the issues portion.


I hope to learn in the near future how to post a link for you all!

-- John in S. IN (jdoofus@hotmail.com), January 23, 2002.

Ok. Test drive on the link bizness.

Well, let's see

-- John in S. IN (
jdoofus@hotmail.com), January 23, 2002.

OK! Not exactly perfect, but hey, it's a start! Thanks for allowing me to practice a new thing out on you guys.

-- John in S. IN (jdoofus@hotmail.com), January 23, 2002.

Hey John, you done good!....nothing wrong with a little rant every now and again, is there???(ahem) It's kind of like a purrge;).

Most of you know how intense of a subject this is for me, and I believe your ideas for solutions are excellent. Yet when condoms are passed out to junior high kids, and everyone seeems to just expect kids to have sex, and the consequences of our personal actions are always something we can avoid, or shift, it takes a complete reversal in thought to get people to see what abortion really is. I think it usually sets in on people who have done it in a few years time, but not always. As was said above by someone, it is just so sad how callous we have become to human life.

-- Doreen (bisquit@here.com), January 24, 2002.

Moderation questions? read the FAQ