We have a retail nursery on our property and are thinking of installing an outhouse for the few customers who need the facilities (mostly children). I used to let them use the house toilet, but we are getting too busy for this and have had a few problems.

We live in the very rocky Catskill Mountains - so how deep do you have to dig the privy hole? It's hard digging here. Any solutions to keep flies away? I assume only 3-4 people a week will actually ask use the potty and (if I am lucky) half of those will decline when they see an outhouse. Any practical advice will be appreciated.

-- diane greene (greenwitch@catskillnativenursery.com), February 26, 2002

Answers

Hi Diane;

You might want to check with your local building/plumbing inspector. Because you are a retail operation you might have to meet different standards than just plunking one down out in the woods.

Even here in Maine there are very specific requirements for outhouses. It might be cheaper and easier in the long run to contract with a "porta-potty" company for those months that you would be open.

Ken

-- Ken in Maine (Kenjan@pivot.net), February 26, 2002.

The first question is what does your health dept say. Al has pretty lax rules but a outhouse for the public to use while at your retail location would send the local insprctors into spasums of laughter. Most states have outlawed outhouses for private homes, even Alaska has mandated no more out houses anywhere in the state. I usually just don't do things that would be obviously need a good hard look and pretty well they leave us alone, and don't care but this seems like a red flag waving. Best of luck and just my opinion

-- David in North Al (bluewaterfarm@mindspring.com), February 26, 2002.

But to your question *flies*.......Isn't the answer ; a bag of lime?

Just hide the darn thing behind another shed..

And don't paint it pink!

-- Jim-mi (hartalteng@voyager.net), February 26, 2002.

Go ahead and build your outhouse Diane, there can't be a more ecologically correct method of disposing of human waste.

Just don't call in an outhouse, put a bright sign on the building and letter it "Organic Fertilizer Storage", or some such.

As far as depth, get it as deep as possible, six feet isn't too much, but realistically, three feet probably wouldn't fill up if it has as little use as you think it will. Use slaked lime that you can pick up from the feedstore to keep down the odor. Make certain it is slaked lime and not quick lime or you may walk out one day to find your outhouse missing and used toilet paper hanging from all the nearby trees.

-- Tis I (really_tis_i@yahoo.com), February 26, 2002.

Diane: We are not a retail operation, just a ordinary homestead, but as to your question re: flies, we have an ash bucket full of ashes with a shovel and a small sign posted that says "Please Flush". Seem to solve the fly problem--I think I read somewhere that it is the lye in the ashes. Now, the real challenge is trying to do this all "by the light of the moon", you know, the one carved in the door. With the door shut is can get pretty dark, even in daylight.

-- Marie in Central WA (Mamafila@aol.com), February 26, 2002.

If you are sure about the low usage, why not get a self contained unit like is sold for campers and boaters? Dump it in your tank once a week.

-- Kathy (catfish201@hotmail.com), February 26, 2002.

HI Diane,

When we lived in England we visited the Centre for Alternative Technology (CAT) which is located in Wales. They had a composting toilet (outhouse) which serviced many many people ever day. They used the standard sawdust system (one poop - one scoop). There was no smell and the composted product was used on their non vegetables etc. I know they had very complete plans and if you do an internet search for Centre for Alternative Technology (yes spelled as Centre) you could find info.

Good luck - Kim

-- kim (fleece@eritter.net), February 26, 2002.

I'd do what Tis I said. 3 feet deep is fine. Sometimes people dug them deeper and would just move the outhouse when the hole filled. You could put a hatch on the back so you could clean it out without moving the outhouse.

-- Dave (multiplierx9@hotmail.com), February 26, 2002.

Hello Diane,

We built an outhouse here in the Ozarks a couple of years ago. The soil is very rocky but, we still made the pit six foot deep. It measures 4 foot wide and 8 foot long. We took three rail road ties and laid them across the hole length ways allowing the middle one to be placed so that it was off center. Then we built a floor of oak 2 by 6 with an opening in the middle. From there we added a box with a hole and a toilet seat. The outhouse is an mini a-frame which matches the a-frame house that we now live in. I added dutch doors to the front to allow a person to see the view of the valley while they are sitting. I built a window in the upper back corner for ventilation. We have had no problems with flies as we keep wood ash in a pail next to the toilet to be added into the pit as needed. If you want to see a picture of our outhouse it is on our webpage. Just click to the left of the homepage under the photo album called Life in the Ozarks.

Sincerely,

Ernest

-- http://communities.msn.com/livingoffthelandintheozarks (espresso42@hotmail.com), February 26, 2002.

The Humanure Handbook has instructions for making a simple composting toilet - no holes to dig. It's a good book & very funny. I'm talking dh into making one this summer for our camping area in the woods - I don't want the kids to just be going everywhere!

-- Bonnie (stichart@plix.com), February 26, 2002.

For the kind of usage you are talking about you won't even need a hole in the ground. Just sprinkle with lime every few days to control flies and smell. A big hole would only be needed if someone was really full of it.

-- charlie (charliesap@pldi.net), February 27, 2002.

agree the kids probably wont use it. they wont use it at the state parks either

-- js (schlicker54@aol.com), February 27, 2002.

We are not allowed to build outhouses where I live in Maine. If you have an outhouse on the property already it is ok. We had an outhouse for years on the property and when we built our home we took it down. Big Mistake. There are times it would come in handy like when the power is out or you are working in the yard. We would through a scoop of lime in it after use and it kept the flies away.

-- Irene Burt (renienorm@aol.com), February 27, 2002.

My place is on "sugar sand." When you did a hole here, the soil around the perimeter of the hole keeps sluffing back into the hole. There was no way that I could of dug a hole for my outhouse that wouldn't of required a lot of shoring and bracing. So what I did was purchase a 300-gallon plastic tank and buried that into the ground. I built the outhose over the tank. So now, if the tank ever fills up, I will simply have it pumped out. --Happy trails, Cabin Fever

-- Cabin Fever (cabinfever_mn@yahoo.com), February 27, 2002.

Diane,

Dh and I purchased "The Humanure Handbook". Saved us a ton of cash because we built our own composting potty. No smells or flies as long as it is "flushed" with peat moss or sawdust. Detailed, easy to follow instructions are in the book. The author offers to send a free copy of his book to any "town father" that has a problem with the concept. I feel it's one of our most valuable homestead books because our new homestead is on land that does not "perc".

-- Ann K (Ann1956ann@hotmail.com), February 27, 2002.

We have been using a simple composting method in our "outhouse" at our cabin for the last couple years. It works great. We built an outhouse without the hole...the whole bench seat hinges up and we can store 3 5 gallon buckets under it. We keep sawdust in two and use the other. Instead of flushing you just dump a can full of sawdust on top. When it's full empty in the woods in an out-of-the-way place and cover with leaves and grass. Keep emptying in the same spot and soon there is a pile of compost. Still can't believe it doesn't smell!

BTW don't know where the guy got the idea Alaska outlawed outhouses. I checked with our local Health Dept and it is a legal sewage disposal method even here in a not very rural area. In the "bush" it is the only way.

-- marty (marty@inalaska.org), February 28, 2002.

I did the humanure type as well. A 10gal bucket, under an old wooden box with a toilet hole cut in it, with an old toilet seat on top of that. I used sawdust and dead tea leaves for a fulsh. No smell, easy to maintain, no digging. Thats the way to go. Particularly because you can compost the muck where you want, instead of not really having any control over where it leaches.

-- snoozy (bunny@northsound.net), February 28, 2002.

An outhose is not the best way. My family and I have been using the sawdust bucket idea or almost 3 years now. We use sawdust to cover our excrement and there is no smell. From there it is dumped into a compost bin where nature can take its course. Look at http://jenkinspublishing.com/messages/ to find any answers you have. Joe can and will answer any questions you may have when it comes to humanure composting and why an outhouse isn't the way to go. BTW I have a $1000 compost toilet sitting up in the woods (not being used)because of the sawdust toilet method. As far as I'm concerned, 3 times a week of useage would be very minimal work for you at the right cost.

-- OAK (StrugglingOak@aol.com), March 01, 2002.