This is a sort of carry over from the media stuff on the QM thread.

Latest estimates from one of the earth watch organisations give something like 30 years at the rate they're being hacked down, until there'll be no rainforests anywhere on the earth.

The video footage in just the few minutes there was of it, painted a picture that should have everybody with the slightest interest in trying to keep the best bits of the world intact, screaming for some sort of drastic action against the illegal logging gangs.

These bastards are in the same league as drugs cartels, having their own private armies, and it seems so obvious to me that nothing short of armed intervention will have any effect in time, that I can't understand why we're even contemplating trying to solve the problem diplomatically, because the local governments seem to be little better, the amount of corruption there is.

The impression is that they're hacking these magnificent plants down as fast as they can before we're forced to do something, and my take on it was that however well meant, no amount of verbal persuasion will have the slightest effect.

It's a sort of global passive smoking thing. They're being allowed, and I choose the words carefully - we're not doing enough to stop them, so, yes, they're being allowed - to carry out an activity the consequences of which could kill me and mine and which I'm powerless to prevent.

I'm nearly tempted to comment 'Thank god I'll be well out the way when the effects start to be felt', although if it's left to the politicians and diplomats, these rain forests probably won't last even 30 years.

-- Anonymous, April 04, 2002

Answers

It is quite terrifying that it is going on and we just sit here complacenty ignoring the fact. For some unknown reason, it seems that a lot of people either aren`t particularly aware of it, or just don`t fear the implications of this particular ecological nightmare. (:o!

-- Anonymous, April 04, 2002

I remember reading an article once giving the statistics regarding the amount of deforestation caused by the use of disposable nappies. I can remember the exact figures, but I do remember being totally gob- smacked by the figures.

-- Anonymous, April 04, 2002

I was raised with washable towel nappies, so you can't blame me :)

It was more a money thing, as my parents couldn't afford to buy disposable nappies.

If it's true about the 30 years statement, then that really is quite frightening. Surely some world leader must give a damn somewhere, enough to do something about it.

The last statement like that I heard was that an area the size of Wales of rainforest is destroyed every *****. Where the ***** is I can't remember the time period. Might have been a year, might have been a month, either way it's a lot of trees.

-- Anonymous, April 04, 2002

I remember once hearing that if everyone in the world used toilet paper at the same rate as the average American, all the world's trees would be used up in one day.

-- Anonymous, April 04, 2002

The "Leader@of the free world" and president of the world`s largest polluter wouldn`t even sign the Kyoto treaty so I think we can see where his priorities lie.

-- Anonymous, April 04, 2002

That's only the tip of the iceburg. He's undermined environmental programs in this country via secret meetings where he was able to sign some kind of legislation favoring industry without anyone knowing about it. One glaring example is how he killed off a program Clinton instituted to force car makers to increase minimum gas mileage.

One bright note is Maryland has been fairly forward thinking in trying to control development around the state and preserving land important to local flora and fauna. Of course this year the budgets for these programs look like getting slashed pretty heavily as state legislators don't see it as being 'important' anymore. I do despair on how this can be accomplished on a larger scale when it's such a fight in one small state. :-(

-- Anonymous, April 04, 2002

The trouble is that there are far too many of us as a species. And all aspire to American/European patterns of consumption, which would be unsustainable. It would be nice, over time, to get our numbers thinned out a bit, without the usual methods of war, disease and famine, which tend to happen in areas where unsustainable levels of consumption aren't achieved anyway.

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

News report this morning says that there is a half mile wide asteroid on a collision course with the Earth. So, if we haven`t already done the job ourselves, the asteroid will do it for us in 850 years.

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

OK, seeing as the subject has been raised, lets be honest and see what measures the folk on here take to `save the planet`. I`ll start the ball rolling......

I used terry nappies, and always buy them as new baby presents and encourage new mums to do the same. I try very hard to not buy vegetables and fruit that have been flown halfway round the world, and use biodegradeable binbags etc.

On the negative side, both Pete and I drive cars, I cannot bring myself to buy recycled toilet paper and don`t know how I would live without kitchen roll.

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

Recycle all my newspapers and bottles. Just emailed the council to join their household waste reduction scheme - mainly cos I get a free compost bin. Yay!

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

Galaxy, We're still deciding whether to use disposable or cloth nappies for our little one, who is due in June. As beginners we've got no idea what would be best. Any advice you could give me would be greatly aprreciated.

Oh, and I do try to recycle bottles, etc. But it's not easy in France!

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

I recycle all dry packaging (paper/card/plastic etc.) in the local council provided recycling bins. We have 3 wheelie bins provided: compostable waste(collected fortnightly), dry recyclables(fortnightly), usual crap(weekly). The normal waste is now neglible of you can be arsed to sort out the stuff. I also have another bin for bottles (which fills up alarmingly quickly!).

Aren't I good ;-))

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

If you take into account the washing of terry nappies (power consumption, water use, detergent polution) you would probably be doing the panet a favour by using disposables.

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

That's what I'd heard Geordie. I suppose it depends on who you listen to though.

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

It's the same with recycling. Have you any idea how much pollution is caused by recycling? The whole recycling process causes both air and water pollution.

By the way car drivers, you do realise that everytime you use your car you are not only polluting the air, but you are also polluting streams and rivers.

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

But it's not all bad news. If global warming continues, Whitley Bay will become just as hot as Teneriffe - great for tourism! And rising sea levels will flood London and most of the south east - see, every cloud has a...etc...

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

I try and read my newspapers in the shop :-) but if I do buy them they are always recycled. I recycle glass bottles and jars, tin cans, and any plastic bottles.

As for nappies, I have no recollection of ever having used one, so I can only assume I was born toilet-trained which must have saved me mam a lot of work as well as saving the planet.

My guess is that recycling only improves the situation marginally, if at all. Our levels of consumption are too high and the packaging industry is ridiculous. I can't see many of us cutting down though, so it seems we will be forced to find technological solutions to make current lifestyles sustainable for all.

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

The thing about global warming, and this to my knowledge has not been reported in the media, is that it is always warmer at the end of a century as opposed to the middle - the 1890's were warmer than the 1940's. Also, the sea levels are rising. This is nothing new. I have stood on a beach that was 40 feet above sea level in Devon. It used to be sea level it isn't anymore.

We do have serious environmental issues but it is not always as bad as the media portrays.

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

Most of the councils here provide 2 bins, 1 for general rubbish and one for recycle-ables. We have far more in the recycling bin.

We used a nappy service for the gusette, they supplied flanellete nappies until about 6 months then terry ones. They picked up the soiled ones twice a week then dropped down to once a week as she was older.

Galaxy, the recycled toilet paper is normal paper recycled, not toilet paper recycled!! :o). You can also get kitchen paper that is made of recycled paper.

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

3 wheelie bins!!! You'd have to be a millionaire in London to have enough space to keep 3 wheelie bins! I have to admit that our kids used (youngest still uses) disposable nappies, and they account for about 30% of our rubbish. Recycle all glass and paper and most cans and tins. Also try and make use of farmers markets where possible - fresh local produce albeit at a price.

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

Recycle papers and bottles. Cycle to work. And the combination of opting not to have any children and supporting Newcastle sending me to an early grave means I'm doing my bit for overpopulation.

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

I recycle paper by lighting our fire in the living room. There's a good supply of coal in our area, and we burn propane for our cooker. We have a supply of locally cut wood (from managed forest) in the garage for fire too. Nearest to geo-friendliness I managed was to get to our local bottle bank (Hexham, 15 mile away) and deposit 14 bottles (bit of a binge over Easter with my bro-in-law). To be honest, I would probably burn more petrol going back and forth to the recycling centre than would gain me brownie points with Greenpeace.

Am I the least 'green' BBSer?

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

Have to say I'm not terribly green either, other than driving a small, fuel efficient car and trying to shoot death rays out of my eyes in the direction of the ubiquitous gas guzzling tanks people insist on in this country while whinging about the 'high' gas prices.

Since my complex doesn't participate in any kind of recycling scheme, the closest I get it re-using plastic shopping bags as trashcan liners, and periodically taking any excess build-up of un-(re)used plastic bags to the recycling bin at the supermarket.

Amusingly, the company I'm working for right now uses recycled paper for copiers/printers and tries to insist on making double-sided copies as much as possible, has bins throughout the building for recycling bottles/cans/paper, yet they allow the cafeteria to use styrofoam containers. (?!)

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

Guss, I guessed that it was recycled paper, not recycled toilet paper, but I can`t get past the original image in conjured! (;o)

As for the nappy issue, I would still go for terrys - can`t you get ecp-friendly washing powder now?

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

`ecp-friendly` ?!!!? `Guss` with two s`s ?!!!? Somebody`s moved the keys around on my computer while I`ve been out! (;o)

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

I wouldn't worry too much on the nappy score, they're probably made from sustainable resources - quick growing conifers etc - not the centuries old hardwood trees that these log gangs go for. It's probably the building and furniture trades that should clean up their acts.

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

We recycle all our bottles and cans, believe me there are a lot of them

The newspapers get used for the rabbit's cage.

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

I recycle almost all the water I drink. Well, you've got to do your bit for the planet, haven't you! ;o{)

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

When your Y fronts are made out of fig leaves, Clarky, that's when you'll get my vote. :-{E}

-- Anonymous, April 05, 2002

Recycled fig leaves?

-- Anonymous, April 06, 2002

You're hard men! ;o{)

-- Anonymous, April 06, 2002

That's the point of fig leaves, you can never tell. :-{E}

-- Anonymous, April 06, 2002

I figured that Galaxyy, just a cheap laugh at your expense!!

-- Anonymous, April 07, 2002

We recycle all our newspaper - this involves taking two or three Tesco blue boxes FULL every week to the Tesco recycling point. My old man is our local newsagent's pension fund.

We recycle bottles and other glass and keep all plastic carrier bags - heaven knows why, you rarely get the chance to use them again - they have taken over three rooms in the house so far.

I agree entirely with whoever it was made the comment about our packaging industry. Easter eggs are a case in point - just how much packaging does the equivalent of a small bar of chocolate need. And how many times you do buy boxes/packets of stuff which are only half full. Why not just make smaller packets or boxes?

-- Anonymous, April 07, 2002

Is all this recycling really worth the bother ?

Seems to me we're just prolonging the agony of relying on stuff that at one stage or another came out of the ground.

The sooner there's nowt left to 'dig up', the sooner we might get round to having a real go at utilising the bottomless pit of energy pouring out of the sky 24 hours a day.

-- Anonymous, April 07, 2002

My brother in law's dad drives a wagon for a North Tyneside Council and he reckons you can put your rubbish in as many categories as you like but until they get a recycling plant to take it to then it all ends up in the same tip. Pissed on my firework I can tell you.

-- Anonymous, April 07, 2002

Recycle the usual bottles, newspapers and cans. Also use household waste to make compost which goes on the garden and allotment to grow our own fruit and vegetables.

-- Anonymous, April 07, 2002