I grew up Catholic and was married to a Catholic woman in 1988. She became athiest and we divorced 6 years later. Neither of us were practicing catholics at the time. Since then, I met a wonderful Methodist woman and we were married in her church.

I (still) have friends that are Catholic and they would like me to be the godparent of their newborn. They thought that a catholic preist could 'bless' my marriage and that would be sufficient. I guess I am still catholic, although from a quick glance at the posts on this site, presumably living in sin because my first marriage was in the catholic church and was never officially annuled by the church.

Any help you can give me on how to be a godparent would be appreciated.

-- Joe Johnson (mrblackmojo@hotmail.com), January 01, 2003

Answers

Sadly, it seems like you may not be able to assume the role of a godparent right now. I base this on my years as a catechist for unbaptised adults who seek sponsors. Without an annulment, and gaining the Church's recognition of your current marriage, I suspect you do not meet the requirements of being a godparent in the Catholic Church. I could be mistaken. Someone, please correct me if I am mistaken.

-- Melissa Wilson (meanolemelissa@hotmail.com), January 01, 2003.

Dear Joe,

Apart from the moral issues involved, a godparent must be "a practicing Catholic in good standing with the Church", and must produce a signed statement from his pastor verifying that status.

Peace to you. Paul

-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), January 01, 2003.

You are probably right, Melissa. I rather doubt that the pastor or bishop would make an exception to the emphasized point in the ruling canon from the Code of Canon Law [see below]. If Joe had returned to active practice of the faith a while ago, and if he had set the nullity process in motion, then that would probably have been taken as a good-faith sign that he could meet the qualifications.

Canon 874 §1 -- To be admitted to undertake the office of sponsor, a person must:
1° be appointed by the candidate for baptism, or by the parents or whoever stands in their place, or failing these, by the parish priest or the minister; to be appointed the person must be suitable for this role and have the intention of fulfilling it;
2° be not less than sixteen years of age, unless a different age has been stipulated by the diocesan bishop, or unless the parish priest or the minister considers that there is a just reason for an exception to be made;
3° be a catholic who has been confirmed and has received the blessed Eucharist, and who lives a life of faith which befits the role to be undertaken;
4° not labor under a canonical penalty, whether imposed or declared;
5° not be either the father or the mother of the person to be baptized.
§2 A baptized person who belongs to a non-Catholic ecclesial community may be admitted only in company with a Catholic sponsor, and then simply as a witness to the baptism.

Joe, don't take it too hard. Please come back to weekly Mass, become a member of your local parish, and talk to the pastor about your marriage irregularity. We will be praying for you to be ready for the next opportunity to be a baptismal sponsor.

God bless you.
John

-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), January 01, 2003.

Sorry, Paul. We posted almost simultaneously. I didn't realize that you were in the process of replying. JFG

-- (jfgecik@hotmail.com), January 01, 2003.

Thanks for the information and well wishes.

Just want to let you know that I am a still a Christian. My wife is a member of Methodist church and I go to church with her now.

I have a problem with the concept of annulment and consequently will not begin this process. My first wife and I were practicing Catholics and entered into marriage freely and were married for 6 years. Despite her having a change of heart with respect to religion and God, I don't believe that this means the marriage didn't take place. I also didn't want to remain married because if/when we had children, we would have problems raising them with split philosophy on God. So we divorced.

There is nothing sinful about our relationship. It is based on Love and commitment and respect and is Christ centered.

My belief is that adultery is when one cheats on their spouse. I am not cheating on my first wife - we agreed to part ways. I know the Church still recognizes the first marriage and therefore, if I am with someone else, “I must be cheating”. They don't recognize the divorce papers in civil court. Man cannot undo what God has done. However, a tribunal panel (presumably men) can sign a paper and 'voila' the marriage didn't take place. Then everything is OK.

God is smarter that that. He knows what's in your heart and doesn't need bureaucracy sort it out.

Thanks again for your replies and wishes. I hope you don't take my reply the wrong way. I have a lot of love and respect for Catholics. Much of my friends and family are practicing Catholics. I have also seen first hand the workings of the Methodist church and believe that there are many good people there too. Again, I think it comes down to what is truly in your heart. That's what gets expressed to other people through your actions and that, ultimately, is what it’s all about.

Peace. Joe

-- Joe Johnson (mrblackmojo@hotmail.com), January 02, 2003.

Here's a little text from Catholic.com about marriage.

A church can either teach what man wants to believe or teach what Jesus says. Sometimes, Jesus' teachings aren't popular. Valid marriages cannot be dissolved. The Catholic Church only maintains this because Jesus Christ spoke this truth 2000 years ago. Joe, if your marriage is valid, an annulment cannot be granted to you.

Joe, yours is an interesting example. Often, we externalize our spiritual battles as between God and the devil. In this case, the spiritual battle is between a person's opinion and God's truth. These are interesting statements:

[Joe] "My belief is that adultery is when one cheats on their spouse. I am not cheating on my first wife - we agreed to part ways."

It's OK to you, Joe. Is your divorce OK with Jesus? Jesus says, (Mark 10:11) "Whoever divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery against her."

What is the Methodist view of divorce in the context of Mark 10 and Matthew 19?

Mark 10:1-12

Matthew 19:1-12

In Christ,

Mateo

-- (MattElFeo@netscape.net), January 02, 2003.

Dear Joe,

Of course you are still a Christian. Hopefully no-one would suggest otherwise. And hopefully all would agree that there are many wonderful people in the Lutheran church.

However, I don't see how you can have a problem with "the concept of annulment". Either you believe that every union of two people is an action of God, regardless of any and all circumstances surrounding that union; or, you believe that there are certain inviolable criteria which define a Christian marriage - "what God has joined together". If you believe the latter, then you must also believe that the absence of such essential criteria would result in the absence of a valid Christian union. And if you believe that, how can you have a problem with the Church investigating whether the essential criteria were met? Joe, I don't think you have a problem with "the process of annulment". I think you have a problem with your belief that you had no valid grounds for annulment; and you don't wish to "begin this process" because the process would officially confirm what you already know to be true, but don't want to face.

You say you split because you didn't want to raise your children with a "split philosophy on God" - so you married a Protestant instead? I don't doubt that you love each other, and that you have feelings of respect and commitment (presumably you also had these feelings at the time of your first marriage?), but being "Christ-centered" means living according to His teaching, not living according to our personal desires and assuming His approval.

continued .....

-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), January 02, 2003.

No force on earth can separate what God has joined together - not "agreeing to part ways", not a civil decree, and not the men and women on a marriage tribunal. God does indeed know what is in our hearts, and He knows what a fickle and unreliable guide a heart can be. That's why He gave us an objective and infallible guide to the truth - His Church, the Pillar and Foundation of truth (1 Tim 3:15). Jesus didn't say that what is in our hearts will set us free. He said "for where your treasure is, there your heart will be also" (Matt 6:21); and "This people honors me with their lips, but their heart is far away from Me" (Matt 15:8) Jesus said that the truth will set us free.

I hope you find some peace in your decision, your relationship, and your new church. You have abandoned a great treasure to obtain it. But remember, "What does it profit a man to gain the whole world, and forfeit his soul? (Mark 8:36) I am not passing judgement on you, just offering a pertinent passage for your consideration, from the Holy Bible, which I assume is your only guide as a Lutheran.

In Christ, Paul

-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), January 02, 2003.

Paul, before you used the word, "Lutheran," it had not come up on this thread. Joe said that his "current wife" is a Methodist and that he goes to church with her. But he also wrote:
"I guess I am still catholic ..."

You have given him excellent advice and facts, something with which he must really come to terms as a non-practicing Catholic.

Paul, I would like to follow up on one thing you said to Joe, which was this:
"Joe, I don't think you have a problem with 'the process of annulment.' I think you have a problem with your belief that you had no valid grounds for annulment; and you don't wish to 'begin this process' because the process would officially confirm what you already know to be true, but don't want to face."

I would discourage every divorced Catholic, including Joe, from trying to guess whether or not his/her marriage was valid -- or to guess what conclusion a tribunal will draw. Many guesses are bound to be wrong, in either direction.

[continued below]

-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), January 03, 2003.

Joe, you should be aware of the fact that tribunal judges do not have to be men and clergy, but can be women and laity. A prominent canon lawyer, Edward Peters, is a married man who has written a book entitled, "100 Answers to Your Questions on Annulments."

Besides these things, Joe, you need to reflect on the fact that you are not being as fully nourished spiritually as a Catholic should be, by failing to attend Mass and receive Holy Communion. (If you receive something there, it is just bread and wine, not the Body and Blood of Jesus.)

Joe, you are going to services in a Church where a good bit less than the whole of religious truth is taught and where the formal doctrine even fails to condemn all abortions. Your wife's pastor may speak against abortion, but Methodism does not condemn it. At the official site of the "United Methodist Church," I found this: "Delegates to the 1996 General Conference, by a 399-to-497 vote, defeated a 'rights of the unborn' addendum to its 'pro-choice-with-stipulations' stance on abortion. They also voted to continue support for the Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice (formerly the Religious Coalition on Abortion Rights)...".

I urge you to take the steps necessary to "regularize" your "marriage," if that can be done. You can begin to attend Mass (alone or with the woman you love) while waiting for the tribunal to do its work. I hope that she will become a Catholic some day. Joe, please don't neglect the most important thing in life, the salvation of your soul.

God bless you.
-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), January 03, 2003.

Ouch! What a dumb mistake! I wrote:
"Besides these things, Joe, you need to reflect on the fact that you are not being as fully nourished spiritually as a Catholic should be, by failing to attend Mass and receive Holy Communion. (If you receive something there, it is just bread and wine, not the Body and Blood of Jesus.)"

In the parenthetical sentence, the word "there" should be replaced by "at a Methodist service". At a Catholic Mass, we really do receive the Body and Blood of our Lord.
JFG

-- (jfgecik@hotmail.com), January 03, 2003.

Oops! Sorry Joe, about substituting "Lutheran" for "Methodist". It doesn't change anything else I said however. Thanks for the corrrection, J.F.

-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), January 03, 2003.

Joe I am Church of England, and my husband is Catholic. We were married in the Church of England, and next month I will be Godmother to my nephew (My husband's sister's son) who will be Christened in the Catholic faith. I beleive that you can be a godparent as long as there is another Catholic godparent as well. I also don't believe in anullment - how can you pretend that your marriage didn't happen or exist? I don't believe that Jesus won't love you because you aren't a practising Catholic - faith is stronger than rules.

Good Luck!

-- kaha llam (hallamka@hotmail.com), June 01, 2003.

Hello, Kaha.

You must have overlooked the followed words from Catholic Canon Law:
"§2 A baptized person who belongs to a non-Catholic ecclesial community may be admitted only in company with a Catholic sponsor, and then simply as a witness to the baptism."

Although the law does not use the word "godparent," for most Catholics, the words "sponsor" and "godparent" are synonymous. As a member of the "Church of England," you are not able to be a sponsor/godmother to a Catholic child. You are, however, able to be a Christian witness to the child's Baptism.

You wrote: "I don't believe that Jesus won't love you because you aren't a practising Catholic -- faith is stronger than rules."
No one here said "that Jesus won't love" some people. But Jesus loves even mass murderers. His love does not automatically qualify every person to take on every task (e.g., being a Catholic sponsor, a priest, etc.). The Catholic Church lets us know who is qualified or called.

God bless you.
John

-- J. F. Gecik (jfgecik@hotmail.com), June 05, 2003.

Reading these responses reinforces my belief that the Catholic church is more interested in bureaucracy than doing "the right thing".

My wife went through an annullment of her marriage to her first husband (at his request). It appeared to me to be the best approval from God that money could buy.

-- Bob Delaney (rdelaney99@hotmail.com), June 13, 2003.

"A worldly man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised" (1 Corinthians 2:14)

-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), June 13, 2003.