Seances at church

The following appeared in a local newspaper in Newton, Mass., part of the Archdiocese of Boston:

Psychics speak at Our Lady’s Parish

“Join psychic/mediums Nancy Garber and Brenda Lawrence on Friday, April 25 from 7 to 9 PM., at Our Lady’s Help of Christians Parish Hall, 573 Washington Street., Newton. [ed. note: Fr. Walter Cuenin’s parish]. The event is sponsored by the Center for Balance. Non-members pay $45, members $40.”

“Garber, who has been offering Medium Circle, Communicating with Loved Ones at the Center for Balance, has invited Lawrence to join her to demonstrate how they can connect with “spirit” on the other side. For reservations call...."

The only “spirit” on the other side they’ll connect with is the Enemy. Our Lady Help of Christians is perhaps the largest and most visible parish in the archdiocese and it is led by a priest who has shown public disdain for the Church’s teachings. When will a bishop in Boston do something about this? This goes beyond undermining Church teaching to consorting with the occult.

MORE...

In a strange way, this is all very retro. Spiritualism was very popular among the late Victorian and early Edwardians. There was a great controversy, long forgotten, as to whether Christianity and spiritualism were compatible. The more things change, the more things stay the same.

Ye Gods! Ahem, I mean - Good Lord! Is there no end to the lengths this man will go? What’s next – Ouija boards in the confessional…?

It was yanked at the last minute. They had to go down the street to conjure up the dead.

I would love to speculate that complaints caused it to be yanked - - but he has never listened before...so why would he now?

I think he is prepared to run Jellystone Park with the Women's Ordination Conference until the police escort him out of the rectory.

We have a way to go. Please feel free to drop a dime to the Bishop's office and get to know him well.

The more the merrier. I couldn't pass this one up... Bedlam open your doors... I have some new customers for you.

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yacker.com), May 07, 2003

Answers

......East coast, West coast, "One, Holy, Catholic and" Feminist "Church"!

I KNOW A BISHOP NAMED BONEY-MARONI

There was a Bishop named Baloney Or was it Bishop Macaroni?

He built a church out west, brand new. A church for me, a church for you.

Where people drive their pristine cars, Emission pure, no ozone mars.

A church for many kinds of sexes Even witches casting hexes.

There was a Bishop named Marconi Or was it Bishop Boney-Maroni?

He built a church, ten million three. For gender-benders by the sea.

For all to sit, not kneel, awhile, And share your peace with ped-o-phile.

An all new church, on L.A. sod, For me and you...thank God, not God!

JMJ Long-Skirts

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yacker.com), May 07, 2003.

You know Ed, I have greatly enjoyed just spouting off without the worry of trying to be fair to everyone as moderator, but perhaps it's time to start up again. You take a post about a legitimate gripe with the church and follow it with trash worse than Chick came up with. Why you still bother calling yourself Catholic is beyond me.

Frank

-- Someone (ChimingIn@twocents.cam), May 07, 2003.

Frank--
He is touched in the head. Ed would be the wet blanket in ANY gathering, not only our forum. But it's because he is afflicted with a very obvious phobia. It's a sickness, and we should all pray; that Our lord in his mercy may heal Ed, and give him peace.

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), May 07, 2003.

Frank, is calling five traditional Catholics, Thugs and worse, allowed.

If you will check the posts from the opposite sides, you will find all the rotten name calling comes from Eugene, Gesik, Kiwi, and others.

True, the traditionals point out the big problems in the Church, but no personal attacks on anyone until they throw the first stone. And I will tell you why...because they cannot defend against what we say, as it is all on the record, even police records.

Case in point: Diocese of Rockville Centre, Long Island. The scandal stinks to high Heaven, as I write this. One cover up after cver up. Good priests being punished for speakng out. Pedophile priests being sheltered and rewarded. Easy enough to find on the internet.

Do I enjoy pointing this out? Indeed not. However being an ostrich, or being in a spiritual coma, is not going to make it go away.

People like Eugene and John, are doing far more harm to the church than I ever could. They pronounce penalties like, schismatic, heretic, going to hell, and personal ridicule to all of us. Especially me..

As they say "You could look it up. When I tried to make peace with them it seemed as if Satan had turned them loose. Just the past 2 days.

I could go on, but what,s the use. The most that you can do is ban me... The Baptist lost his head, a bit worse don't you think?

God bless you (believe it or not, I mean it)

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), May 07, 2003.

Dioceses hit with $1.85 Billion Sex Abuse Suits ROCKVILLE CENTRE, N.Y. - Nearly three dozen people who claim they were sexually abused by priests in a Roman Catholic diocese on Long Island filed a pair of lawsuits Monday seeking more than $1 billion from the priests and church hierarchy. The following are the Defendants in the case: BISHOP WILLIAM FRANCIS MURPHY REVEREND EUGENE VOLLMER REVEREND ANGELO DITTA ESTATE OF REVEREND WILLIAM MICHAEL BURKE BROTHER HOWARD MURPHY MONSIGNOR ALAN PLACA MONSIGNOR FRANCIS J. CALDWELL MONSIGNOR JOHN ALESANDRO ROMAN CATHOLIC DIOCESE OF ROCKVILLE CENTRE, JOHN DOE and JANE DOE, priests, clergy and Administrators whose names are unknown to the plaintiffs

This is just the milder side of it.

If you want the whole story.. go to google

Rockville centre long island catholic church scandal

Catholics have a right to know where their money goes. They must make their decisions on fact. Do Eugene an John believe that this should not be known?

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), May 07, 2003.

This thread contains the most offensive posts I've ever seen by a so- called Catholic. Since the first time I read any of Ed Richards' posts on this forum, I've doubted that his claim to be Catholic is true. I now have no doubt whatsoever that he's protestant. Satan is obviously at work here. A Catholic who claims to love the Church would be unable to stoop to such depths of depravity. People who are 'up front' about being anti-Catholic are at least honest, whereas people who claim to be Catholic and lead souls away from the Truth are wicked.

May God forgive him.

-- Sara (sara_catholic_forum@yahoo.co.uk), May 07, 2003.

Ed, there's no shortage of evidence that sinners are always active; in or OUT of our Holy Church. Christ clearly prophesied that scandal would occur; and no one here whitewashes the sins of another Catholic, particularly an evil priest.

We had this out with a number of horrid anti-Catholics here last year. You might find it hard to believe, but the Catholic priesthood numbers thousands of holy and devout priests, not just the particular examples you're citing. And we sure don't support any of them; IF they're guilty. (They have not all been judged either guilty or innocent. I realise where there's smoke, there's frequently fire.) Their sins are not as a result of the Popes and any Council. You are just a brute if that's your conclusion, Ed.

You love the subject of money, it seems? Judas was one of the twelve apostles; he was greedy for silver and he fell from grace. It's the same situation in our day; one will be the traitor to his vocation, and eleven will be holy and blameless. A heavens-eye view of Christ's Church.

The subject of name-calling /

Don't charge me for that. I am not John Gecik; and others who are explicit in their anger for you & your falsehoods. I call you muckraker because of the muck you haul in here, like this previous post of yours. It bears no likeness to the Catholic Church. She is Holy. It is an accusation against some evil- doers who have failed in their vocations.

Look into the past, and see. Every age has had its evildoers; even the golden ages of Catholic history.

I call you a fanatic and anyone can see by your rabid behavior I'm only saying what's true. A sick man because I don't hold you responsible for your unholy actions. Actions like blasphemy, contumacy and hypocrisy. You've been an evil influence here, and evil has to be spoken out against. In some posts I have resorted to playing with you; but Hey-- God has a place in heaven even for clowns. A place for Novus Ordo clowns, even.

Remember you accused us of bringing ''topless babes'' into the Mass? Very low humor, Ed. That explains for you, why we leave you out in the cold. God will not have blasphemers in heaven, & you simply don't deserve the time of day.

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), May 07, 2003.

Where there's smoke there may be fire. On the other hand the possibility of a quick cash payoff by making a bit of smoke is sure to attract a few arsonists - for some of them a particularly attractive possibility if they can hurt God's Church in the process.

-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), May 07, 2003.

I know, Paul;
It wouldn't be like Ed, however, to give priests of our Church the benefit of the doubt. He has won the Golden Shovel award for Vatican-bashing many years running. He's fascinated by dirt. Lol!

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), May 07, 2003.

So the garbage continues: Protestant , money mad church basher, and what else. Same old song and same old cast.

Meanwhile you walking zombies turn all your fire on those that want to save their church. Why don’t you turn your anger to the criminals like, Law,Murphy, Eganand the vicious gang that hide in the robes of the church, while theyprotect criminals. That bunch of wolves in sheep’s clothing are criminals who would be in prison this very minute, except for an escape clause and statute of limitations.

And you are afraid to mention these people by name, and would have continued to allow them to continue their criminal ways, to save the cloth... Oh ye suckers! They count on the gullible like you.. And so it will continue... look in the mirror yourselves and when you come to judgement you will have a lot of answering to do yourselves.. “Did you protect My Holy Innocents”? What will your answer be....”We wanted to be faithful Catholics Lord”.

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), May 07, 2003.

The Holy Spirit has already accepted the job of saving the Church. Our job is to obey the Church.

-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), May 07, 2003.

oh yes ed,

homosexuals infiltrating the church was the fault of VII, you know that clause that says gay pedofiles will have first pick of seminaries? GROW UP. the people who committed these crimes were EVIL. any novus ordo will tell you that. its not like we think what happened was okay. if youre so busy saving the church, then tell me please why YOU didnt step in and do something about it... i can answer that for you: because you were just as in the dark as the rest of the world about the problem.

you dont want to be called a scismatic? hows blasphemer work for you? i talked to a pretty good cannonist today who told me that SSPXers arent necessarily excomunicated unless they condone the actions of lefebvre, and they reject the true church. both of those seem to fit your bill. you are a heretic and thats the bottom line. go to a forum for the others who cant stand the one true church, this is not the place for you.

-- paul (dontsendmemail@notanaddress.com), May 07, 2003.

Can any thinking person actually believe that homosexual priests were not molesting adolescent boys prior to vatican II???

-- Paul (PaulCyp@cox.net), May 08, 2003.

ha ha ha. Nice Paul. I agree, except that, well, it's really not worth it, but no, no *thinking* person can believe that altar boys were not being molested before Vat II... can they ?

I mean, really.

-- OperaDiva (solosoprano@juno.com), May 08, 2003.

It seems crazy that a few bad priest could destroy the Catholic Church.

The Catholic gives money, but how it is used shouldn't be of any great concern to the giver. The spender would have to answer to any wrong doings, not the giver.

rod. .

-- rod (elreyrod@yahoo.com), May 08, 2003.

The Diocese of Rockville Centre:

It can’t be trusted in anything

Thomas A. Droleskey, Ph.D.

REMNANT COLUMNIST, New York

“Grand Jury Report on LI Diocese: Church Failed Abuse Victims and Can’t Be Trusted.” Thus read the full front page headline of Long Island Newsday on Monday, February 10, 2003. Sure, Newsday is an anti-Catholic rag. Unfortunately, however, the Diocese of Rockville Centre has given anti-Catholics in the secular media a great deal of ammunition in the last few years to serve as the tool of the Adversary to demoralize average Catholics. Do not blame the messenger for the news contained in Newsday’s headline. Blame the Diocese of Rockville Centre. Completely. Totally.

The text of Newsday’s story, “Sins of the Fathers,” written by Rita Ciolli, dealt with a grand jury report filed in New York State Supreme Court (the lowest court in the State of New York) on Friday, February 7, 2003, and released by the District Attorney of Suffolk County, New York, Thomas Spota, on Monday, February 10. A few excerpts from the news story will suffice:

“The grand jury report details how cheerleaders were raped, altar boys were sodomized and Catholic youths were shown pornographic movies and plied with alcohol in rectory bedrooms.

“In one instance, according to the report, a pastor found a homemade pornographic movie in a priest’s bedroom. After watching the tape, he realized that a 15-year-old boy from the parish was involved in one of the sex acts. The pastor reported the incident to the ‘highest level of the diocese.’

“Despite the fact that the offending priest admitted to the abuse during subsequent treatment and the crime was prosecutable, ‘no consideration was given to reporting the abuse to law enforcement,’ according to the report. Neither was an effort made to locate and assist the victim, it said.

“‘Not one priest in the diocese who knew about these criminal acts reported them to any law enforcement agency,’ the grand jury report stated in recommending changes to state law that would mandate that priests and other church supervisors report such crimes.

“Using testimony from victims and internal documents obtained by subpoena, the report finds that abusive priests were transferred from parish to parish despite pastors, other priests and school principals repeatedly asking that the accused clerics be stopped from ministering.

“In one case, according to the findings, a priest who reported his concerns and helped the victim’s mother pursue her complaint had a memo placed in his file from a high-ranking official saying ‘no serious consideration’ would be given to offering the concerned priest another assignment.

“‘In the diocese of Rockville Centre, a priest who molests children should suffer no disgrace, but one who advocates on their behalf risks banishment,’ the report says.”

This news story came a day after an extensive report in Newsday that evaluated how the Most Reverend William F. Murphy, Bishop of Rockville Centre, handled the sodomite cases when he was a top official under Bernard Cardinal Law in the Archdiocese of Boston in the 1990s. As vicar general and moderator of the curia, Bishop Murphy exhibited extraordinary solicitude for one sodomite priest after another, including the notorious Father Paul Shanley, a founder of the North American Man-Boy Love Association (NAMBLA).

Newsday reporters Rita Ciolli and Joseph Mallia reviewed over 40,000 pages of documentation, including files from the Archdiocese of Boston, in a court in the Commonwealth of Massachusetts. They reported on Bishop Murphy’s interest in Father Shanley’s case:

“By the mid-1990s Shanley and Murphy exchanged numerous letters arranging to have Shanley’s legal fees paid because some accusers had hired lawyers and the Boston archdiocese was negotiating for their silence in exchange for financial settlements.

“Shanley expressed gratitude for Murphy’s warmth and prompt attention to his requests for money and other favors. . . . In March of 1994, Shanley asked for an extra $300 a month to help pay the high cost of his rent in New York City, and Murphy pleaded his case before the relevant Boston committee–which Murphy headed and which approved the payments, records show.”

Although Bishop Murphy’s problems preceded his appointment as the fourth ordinary of the Diocese of Rockville Centre in 2001, his approach as Boston’s vicar general has fit very neatly into the culture of deceit that was perfected in the Diocese of Rockville Centre under the episcopate of the late Bishop John Raymond McGann, who was the diocesan ordinary from 1976 until January of 2000. The cost in terms of souls wrought by this culture of deceit is incalculable.

In point of fact, however, the way in which the Diocese of Rockville Centre under Bishop McGann permitted sodomite priests to continue their abuse of the physical bodies of young victims should come as no surprise. It was under Bishop McGann’s destructive tenure as diocesan ordinary that out-and-out heresies were tolerated in diocesan schools and from parish pulpits. It was under his leadership that the envelope was pushed over and over again on liturgical “innovations.” He had a deaf ear and a blind eye when it came to liturgical abuses. He failed to take action when outright error was pointed out to him. Indeed, it is the case in most instances that those who put into question articles contained in the Deposit of Faith or made outlandish comments were promoted.

As it has fallen to me over the years to chronicle in print the sad state affairs in the diocese where I grew up and have spent four-fifths of my life, there is no need to recite all of the evidence I have amassed over the years about how the Diocese of Rockville Centre has demonstrated that it is not to be trusted in anything, especially as it relates to the formation, sanctification and salvation of souls. However, a very selected few instances of how the spiritual abuse of souls led all too naturally to the physical abuse of bodies will help to illustrate the point made by Father James McLucas at a conference in New Jersey in May of 2002: “The entire postconciliar structure of the Church is corrupt to the core.”

Bishop McGann was not content to be on the cutting edge of promoting liturgical “innovations” and what he called an “updated” theology. He quite actively persecuted priests, both pastors and curates, who were considered to be “too conservative.” It was twenty years ago next month, in March of 1983, that McGann tried to purge four “conservative” pastors, including Father Robert Mason, who had been pastor of Our Lady of Lourdes Church in Massapequa Park, New York, since 1976. Three of the pastors resigned when ordered to do so by McGann. Father Mason refused, demonstrating his willingness to be suspended as the price of his orthodoxy.

Father Mason was told by Bishop McGann on March 16, 1983, that he had ten days to resign or be suspended. There were no grounds whatsoever to suspend Father Mason. Father Mason was simply zealous for souls and talked from the pulpit about the possibility of souls going to Hell after death. He had hired a very orthodox woman to run his religious education program, and this perhaps angered McGann more than anything else. For the woman, Mrs. Marion Harrington, would not use the catechetical texts required by the diocese and brought in such speakers such as the late Father Vincent Miceli to address students in her program. Father Mason simply had to go, and he had to be willing to give his own head on a silver platter to McGann.

As I had known Father Mason since my first day in kindergarten at Saint Aloysius School in Great Neck, Long Island, in September of 1956 (and was teaching in his religious education program in the 1982-83 school year), I knew that a great injustice was being done to a priest who was zealous for souls. Father Mason, who is still pastor of the same parish, will hear a confession anytime of the day or night. He takes Holy Communion to the sick and the dying. He has a priestly bearing about him. And although he is quite unsympathetic to the restoration of the Traditional Latin Mass, which has been the subject of several protracted conversations between us in recent years, he cultivates devotion to Blessed Sacrament (spending much time in front of Our Lord each day) and total consecration to the Mother of God. His tender, filial love for Our Lady inspired many of us in our childhood to pray the Rosary daily and to be consecrated to Our Lady’s Immaculate Heart. This is the sort of priest who has been marked for pastoral execution by Bishop McGann.

Well, making a quite long and involved story as short as possible, Father Miceli, then in residence at Holy Apostles Seminary in Cromwell, Connecticut, told me when I consulted him over the phone that the best thing to do was to write to Silvio Cardinal Oddi, who was then the Prefect of the Sacred Congregation for the Clergy. I sent a twelve-page, single-spaced typewritten letter to Cardinal Oddi, documenting the problems in the Diocese of Rockville Centre. The letter was sent via air courier on March 22, 1983, arriving at his residence early the next morning, March 23. By the time Father Mason went to see Bishop McGann on March 26, Cardinal Oddi had telegraphed him to say that he, McGann, was to take no action against Father Mason until he came to Rome after Easter for the ad limina apostolorum visit with the other New York Province bishops. Father Mason received a temporary stay of execution at the time, which became permanent following the collection and sending of 492 other letters to Cardinal Oddi in the interim between March 26 and April 10, 1983.

Cardinal Oddi told me the following when I met with him in his office, which was located on the Via Della Conciliazione, in October of 1984: “Your bishop came to see me after you wrote your nice letter. He sat where you are sitting. We had a little chat. He changed his mind.” His Eminence clasped his hands together, moving his fingers as though he were playing a trumpet, smiling quite broadly as though to communicate a sense of great enjoyment in relating his encounter with Bishop McGann. He went on to say, “You know what I told him? I said, ‘I want no more persecution of men who love the Mother of God. Do I make myself clear?’”

Bishop McGann’s antipathy for “conservative” priests included denying pastorates to younger priests noted for their orthodoxy. Indeed, one younger priest, ordained in 1978, was not made a pastor until Bishop James T. McHugh, who was appointed McGann’s coadjutor bishop with full rights of succession in 1998, had succeeded McGann in the year 2000. This priest was denied one pastorate after another. No small part of McGann’s hostility for him was the fact that he was one of the first priests in the United States to get his celebret for the Traditional Latin Mass directly from Rome following the Ecclesia Dei motu proprio of 1988.

Although the diocese instituted a weekly indult Mass every Sunday in November of 2002, it has resisted all efforts for a daily Traditional Mass and rejected all requests for traditional Nuptial and Requiem Masses. Monsignor Ronald Hayde, the diocesan liturgical director, told me in November that the diocese takes a very restrictive view of the 1988 decree of the Holy Father. He didn’t even want to discuss how approximately twenty dioceses in this nation permit daily Mass and all of the sacraments according to the 1962 Missal. The great generosity shown “gays and lesbians” and charismatics is not extended to traditional Catholics in the Diocese of Rockville Centre.

As much as Bishop McGann had antipathy for priests who were merely conservative, no less fully traditional, he bent over backwards not only to protect the sodomites but to promote men who were openly supportive of women’s ordination to the priesthood. McGann recommended that then-Monsignor Emil Wcela, who had been rector of Immaculate Conception Seminary for some years in the 1970s, be made an auxiliary bishop of the diocese in 1988. Perhaps not so amazingly, the Holy Father agreed, since Wclea was on record in support of women’s ordination, a position he still holds. He has participated in feminist paraliturgies and has been one of the boldest supporters of so-called “inclusive” language in the English translation of the Novus Ordo. McGann requested the Holy Father to make Wcela his coadjutor in the 1990s, a request that was, fortunately, denied.

One other example will suffice.

Monsignor Frank Gaeta, now the pastor of Saints Cyril and Methodius Church in Deer Park, Long Island, wrote a pamphlet of Lenten reflections in the 1990s. Included in the pamphlet was the statement, found on the page dealing with Tuesday of Holy Week, that Judas Iscariot is in Heaven. That’s right. He concluded that particular reflection with “Saint Judas, pray for us.” And Gaeta used his long pastorate at Saint Brigid’s Church in Westbury, New York, to promote sensitivity to the cause of “gays and lesbians,” including a horrific Mass in October of 1997 that included a post-Communion address by a man from Saint Paul’s Church in Manhattan who was an open advocate of homosexual relations as normal and natural expressions of “love.” Easter Vigil Masses at St. Brigid’s under Monsignor Gaeta included readings from Martin Luther King, Jr., and other non-Scriptural sources. Some went on for so long that they actually had a coffee break during the middle of Mass. This is the sort of priest who was beloved by Bishop McGann. And the list could go on and on and on.

McGann’s wreckage is ever-present before me whenever I teach courses at the C. W. Post Campus of Long Island University. Most of my students are Catholic. Most of them do not understand anything about the Catholic Faith, and the little that they think they know is wrong. This wreckage of souls is vast. Bishop McGann helped to bring this about by placing into chancery and parish positions individuals trained in the aftermath of Vatican II to help to deconstruct the Faith of its true meaning. Teachers who practice contraception and support abortion are permitted to be employed in Catholic schools. The most horrific sex-instruction programs are mandated throughout the Catholic school system and at all levels of religious education for Catholic students who attend public schools. Students at a prominent high school, run by a religious community, tell me that they have been taught in class that Purgatory does not exist, that there is no such being as the Devil, and that Genesis is nothing other than didactic fiction. Hordes of baptized and confirmed pagans have been produced as a result, young people who do not know Who God is, what He has revealed through His true Church, and how they are to live their lives as a preparation to make an accounting of themselves before Him at the moment of their Particular Judgments.

To be sure, Bishop Murphy has inherited this wreckage. However, he has exhibited zero interest in addressing it, even going to so far as to rename a girls’ high school for Bishop McGann, a man who is deserving of our prayers for the repose of his immortal soul, but of no public honors, in light of his persecution of believing Catholics and his toleration and promotion of doctrinal dissent and liturgical abuse. As a member of the “club,” however, Bishop Murphy continues the same shopworn practices of his brother bishops: canonize one’s predecessors, pretend everything is well in your midst, do nothing to jeopardize your promotion to a more prestigious see.

Although Bishop Murphy assured the people of the Diocese of Rockville Centre after the release of the Suffolk County grand jury report that he had done “everything right” since assuming control of the diocese on September 5, 2001, the evidence provided to the grand jury by the diocesan priests’ personnel director, Monsignor Francis Caldwell, directly contradicts that assurance.

Monsignor Caldwell was asked why Bishop Murphy had not removed the pastor of Saint Dominic’s Church in affluent Oyster Bay, New York, Monsignor Charles “Bud” Ribaudo, even though the diocese knew of outstanding charges of sodomite behavior with children that had been made against him and accepted by the diocese as true. The interrogator asked Monsignor Caldwell if it was only the fear of bad publicity that caused the removal of Monsignor Ribaudo. Monsignor Caldwell said “yes,” reiterating that answer when the question was asked a second time. A report in Newsday in 2002 noted that one of the reasons Ribaudo, who was quite open about his support of the New Age Movement (billing himself as a graduate of the Ira Progroff Intensive Journal Workshops, a specialist in Silva Mind Control and est, and a practitioner of Dream Therapy), was kept in place for so long was that he was one of the chief fund-raisers for the annual Bishops’ Appeal program. Oh, yes, Bishop Murphy did “everything right” to protect the sacred cow of his annual appeal program, while ignoring the harm that Monsignor Ribaudo had done to children and the incalculable damage he had done to the proper formation of souls. The only thing that mattered to him was bad publicity and the loss of money. Not exactly a model of apostolic zeal.

Yes, this is all the result of the tragedy of the regime of novelty of the past forty years. However, it has to be addressed. The abuse of bodies cited by the grand jury in New York State Supreme Court is the direct result of the abuse of souls. Spiritual abuse leads to physical abuse. As Bishop Murphy has participated in Boston in the systematic cover-up of predators and perverts, he has no credibility to address the real problems extant in the Diocese of Rockville Centre, let alone admit they exist and that one of his predecessors is responsible for them. The Holy Father needs to remove Bishop William Murphy and appoint a man who is going to purge the Diocese of Rockville Centre once and for all of anyone associated with the ancien regime of John Raymond McGann.

This is unlikely to happen. Bishop Murphy is close to Opus Dei, and we know what influence that organization has in Rome. However, it is nevertheless important to pray that Bishop Murphy has the humility to resign so that someone who has not demonstrated the consistently bad judgment he used in Boston and in Rockville Centre can be appointed as Bishop of Rockville Centre to restore simple Catholicism in the life of ordinary Catholics, starting with a desire to permit the celebration of the Traditional Latin Mass on a daily basis.

The anti-Catholic rag known as Newsday has had a field day reporting physical abuse because the Diocese of Rockville Centre continues to promote spiritual abuse. I plead with the Holy Father to end the latter so as to prevent the former. For the destruction of souls is what leads to the abuse and destruction of bodies in this life–and quite possibly for all eternity after death.

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), May 08, 2003.

Dear Ed:
If your motivation for posting these sordid announcements is honorable, the best thing I can advise is, write the bishops, and any of the other parties you consider culpable. When you've reached them, offer them all the web address for this forum. Tell them all to log on (the way you do) and give us faithful Catholics our chance to peck them to death over cyberspace. I would gladly join in, and you can even cast the first stone.

Laying it on us here, is hardly productive, and, forgive me, but; you haven't done it in the interest of justice. It's another sign of your hatred for us, and your overweening hypocrisy.

''People like Eugene and John, are doing far more harm to the church than I ever could. They pronounce penalties like, schismatic, heretic, going to hell, and personal ridicule to all of us. Especially me.''

Is that so? You have penalties ''pronounced'' against you? Nobody is sending you to hell. You'll be judged by Our Lord; and so will I. One thing I do NOT have on my conscience is ''harming'' the Catholic Church. That's your sin, and it is flagrant. Let's see; ''. . . you walking zombies turn all your fire on those that want to save their church--''

May I ask, Ed; how many churches have you ever saved? We'll really be in bad shape if YOU are ever called to save us! Haahaa! Yes. I wish a cuckoo could save the Church. We have one in this forum who feels entitled to quash the last four Popes. We have a ''pretend'' Pope on board!

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), May 08, 2003.

We dont do it alone Gene...but what bit we can do helps... One suggestion.. don't give them any money to pay off those lawsuits.... give it to a good charity... like Father pavone, and his right to life org.

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), May 08, 2003.

I think I'll repeat it, Ed:

You haven't done it in the interest of justice.

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), May 08, 2003.

Who defines justice Eugene?

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), May 08, 2003.

Certainly not you. The Pharisees were always trying that, with Our Lord. And you try, but you haven't been defining much at all. Just nostalgia, nothing of importance.

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), May 09, 2003.

Nostalgia= 1900 years

Circus=40 years

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), May 09, 2003.

Ed,

The year ~65 a.d., spoken by a Pharisee:

Nostalgia: Thousands of years

Circus: 30 years

Were the Pharisees right about Jesus Ed?

Frank

-- Someone (ChimingIn@twocents.cam), May 09, 2003.

Talk about the twin tower terrorists: They knocked down buildings that took 6 years to build.... they were pikers compared to 4 terrorists that destroyed something that 260 faithful guarded for over 1900 years, and tore it apart in 40 years, and they are not done yet.

The only thing I can admire them for is that they were not hypocritical about it... It was a new church and religion, and they called it that..THE NEW ORDER YUP NEW ORDER. STRESS ON 'NEW'!

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), May 09, 2003.

You can see plainly what form Ed's ''loyalty'' to his Church takes: ''compared to 4 terrorists that destroyed something that 260 faithful guarded for over 1900 years, and tore it apart in 40 years, and they are not done yet.''

Our Popes. He condemns Popes. Just as Martin Luther did; it's on the record.

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), May 09, 2003.

Eugene, please stop this phony , tearing of your garments act... These 4 popes, especially number 2 and 4, have done more to destroy Holy Church in a few years, more than all the heretics in history, put together.

Millions have left the Church because of them. They despised anything that smelled of pre V2 substance. Nothing, no nothing is left.

Music, sacraments, consecrations, mass, everything gone. New catechism, add on rosary, prayers to St Michael, and our Blessed Mother, after Mass. No Consecration of Russia,falsely telling heretics that they can be saved outside the Church...No talk of conversions, calling Pius V, Boniface, Innocent, Pius 9,10.11.12. Liars. Very cleverly done by saying, “We don’t teach anything new, no we just are more enlightened in these times..

Poor Eugene, you are just a docile sheep waiting to be sheared, not knowing that you have already been sheared, of your faith. I will pray for you.

You do not even know that we have already had 40 anti-popes. None have done the harm of the present ones.

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), May 09, 2003.

Popes of the Roman Catholic Church

In the following list the date of election, rather than of consecration, is given. Before St. Victor I (189), dates may err by one year. Antipopes, those whose elections have been declared uncanonical, are indicated. Antipopes are those associated with the great Cataclysm and ruled in the Byzantine Empire.

St. Peter d. 64? or 67? St. Linus 67?-76? St. Cletus or Anacletus 76?-88? St. Clement I 88?-97? St. Evaristus 97?-105? St. Alexander I 105?-115? St. Sixtus I 115?-125? St. Telesphorus 125?-136? St. Hyginus 136?-140? St. Pius I 140?-155? St. Anicetus 155?-166? St. Soter 166?-175? St. Eleutherius 175?-189? St. Victor I 189-99 St. Zephyrinus 199-217 St. Calixtus I antipope: St. Hippolytus 217-22 217-35 St. Urban I 222-30 St. Pontian 230-35 St. Anterus 235-36 St. Fabian 236-50 St. Cornelius antipope: Novatian 251-53 251 St. Lucius I 253-54 St. Stephen I 254-57 St. Sixtus II 257-58 St. Dionysius 259-68 St. Felix I 269-74 St. Eutychian 275-83 St. Caius 283-96 St. Marcellinus 296-304 St. Marcellus I c.308-309 St. Eusebius 309-c.310 St. Miltiades or Melchiades, 311-14 St. Sylvester I 314-35 St. Marcus 336 St. Julius I 337-52 Liberius antipope: Felix 352-66 355-65 St. Damasus I antipope: Ursinus 366-84 366-67 St. Siricius 384-99 St. Anastasius I 399-401 St. Innocent I 401-17 St. Zosimus 417-18 St. Boniface I antipope: Eulalius 418-22 418-19 St. Celestine I 422-32 St. Sixtus III 432-40 St. Leo I 440-61 St. Hilary 461-68 St. Simplicius 468-83 St. Felix III (or II) 483-92 St. Gelasius I 492-96 Anastasius II 496-98 St. Symmachus antipope: Lawrence 498-514 498-505 St. Hormisdas 514-23 St. John I 523-26 St. Felix IV (or III) 526-30 Boniface II 530-32 pope or antipope: Dioscurus 530 John II 533-35 St. Agapetus I 535-36 St. Silverius 536-37 Vigilius 537-55 Pelagius I 556-61 John III 561-74 Benedict I 575-79 Pelagius II 579-90 St. Gregory I 590-604 Sabinian 604-6 Boniface III 607 St. Boniface IV 608-15 St. Deusdedit or Adeodatus I 615-18 Boniface V 619-25 Honorius I 625-38 Severinus 640 John IV 640-42 Theodore I 642-49 St. Martin I 649-55 St. Eugene I 654-57 St. Vitalian 657-72 Adeodatus II 672-76 Donus 676-78 St. Agatho 678-81 St. Leo II 682-83 St. Benedict II 684-85 John V 685-86 Conon antipope: Theodore antipope: Paschal 686-87 687 687 St. Sergius I 687-701 John VI 701-5 John VII 705-7 Sisinnius 708 Constantine 708-15 St. Gregory II 715-31 St. Gregory III 731-41 St. Zacharias 741 -52 Stephen II 752 (never consecrated) Stephen II (or III) 752-57 St. Paul I antipope: Constantine antipope: Philip 757-67 767-69 768 Stephen III (or IV) 768-72 Adrian I 772-95 St. Leo III 795-816 Stephen IV (or V) 816-17 St. Paschal I 812-24 Eugene II 824-27 Valentine 827 Gregory IV antipope: John 827-44 844 Sergius II 844-47 St. Leo IV 847-55 Benedict III antipope: Anastasius 855-58 855 St. Nicholas I 858-67 Adrian II 867-72 John VIII 872-82 Marinus I 882-84 St. Adrian III 884-85 Stephen V (or VI) 885-91 Formosus 891-96 Boniface VI 896 Stephen VI (or VII) 896-97 Romanus 897 Theodore II 897 John IX 898-900 Benedict IV 900-903 Leo V antipope: Christopher 903 903-4 Sergius III 904-11 Anastasius III 911-13 Lando 913-14 John X 914-28 Leo VI 928 Stephen VII (or VIII) 928-31 John Xl 931-35 Leo VII 936-39 Stephen VIII (or IX) 939-42 Marinus II 942-46 Agapetus II 946-55 John XII 955-64 Leo VIII or Benedict V (one of these was an antipope) 963-65 964-66 John XIII 965-72 Benedict VI antipope: Boniface VII 973-74 974, 984-85 Benedict VII 974-83 John XIV 983-84 John XV 985-96 Gregory V antipope: John XVI 996-99 997-98 Sylvester II 999-1003 John XVII 1003 John XVIII 1004-9 Sergius IV 1009-12 Benedict VIII antipope: Gregory 1012-24 1012 John XIX 1024-32 Benedict IX 1032-44 Sylvester III 1045 Benedict IX 1045 Gregory VI 1045-46 Clement II 1046-47 Benedict IX 1047-48 Damasus II 1048 St. Leo IX 1049-54 Victor II 1055-57 Stephen IX (or X) antipope: Benedict X 1057-58 1058-59 Nicholas II 1059-61 Alexander II antipope: Honorius II 1061-73 1061-72 St. Gregory VII antipope: Clement III 1073-85 1080-1100 Victor III 1086-87 Urban II 1088-99 Paschal II antipope: Theodoric antipope: Albert antipope: Sylvester IV 1099-1118 1100 1102 1105-11 Gelasius II antipope: Gregory VIII 1118-19 1118-21 Calixtus II 1119-24 Honorius II antipope: Celestine II 1124-30 1124 Innocent II antipope: Anacletus II antipope: Victor IV 1130-43 1130-38 1138 Celestine II 1143-44 Lucius II 1144-45 Eugene III 1145-53 Anastasius IV 1153-54 Adrian IV 1154-59 Alexander III antipope: Victor IV antipope: Paschal III antipope: Calixtus III antipope: Innocent III 1159-81 1159-64 1164-68 1168-78 1179-80 Lucius III 1181-85 Urban III 1185-87 Gregory VIII 1187 Clement III 1187-91 Celestine III 1191-98 Innocent III 1198-1216 Honorius III 1216-27 Gregory IX 1227-41 Celestine IV 1241 Innocent IV 1243-54 Alexander IV 1254-61 Urban IV 1261-64 Clement IV 1265-68 Gregory X 1271-76 Innocent V 1276 Adrian V 1276 John XXI 1276-77 Nicholas III 1277-80 Martin IV 1281-85 Honorius IV 1285-87 Nicholas IV 1288-92 St. Celestine V 1294 Boniface VIII 1294-1303 Benedict XI 1303-4 Clement V 1304-14 John XXII antipope: Nicholas V 1316-34 1328-30 Benedict XII 1334-42 Clement VI 1342-52 Innocent VI 1352-62 Urban V 1362-70 Gregory XI 1370-78 THE GREAT SCHISM 1378-1417 Roman Line Urban VI 1378-89 Boniface IX 1389-1404 Innocent VII 1404-6 Gregory XII 1406-15 Avignon Line antipope: Clement VII 1378-94 antipope: Benedict XIII 1394-1423 antipope: Clement VII 1423-29 antipope: Benedict XIV 1425-30 Pisan Line antipope: Alexander V 1409-10 antipope: John XXIII 1410-15 Martin V 1417-31 Eugene IV antipope: Felix V 1431-47 1439-49 Nicholas V 1447-55 Calixtus III 1455-58 Pius II 1458-64 Paul II 1464-71 Sixtus IV 1471-84 Innocent VIII 1484-92 Alexander VI 1492-1503 Pius III 1503 Julius II 1503-13 Leo X 1513-21 Adrian VI 1522-23 Clement VII 1523-34 Paul III 1534-49 Julius III 1550-55 Marcellus II 1555 Paul IV 1555-59 Pius IV 1559-65 St. Pius V 1566-72 Gregory XIII 1572-85 Sixtus V 1585-90 Urban VII 1590 Gregory XIV 1590-91 Innocent IX 1591 Clement VIII 1592-1605 Leo XI 1605 Paul V 1605-21 Gregory XV 1621-23 Urban VIII 1623-44 Innocent X 1644-55 Alexander VII 1655-67 Clement IX 1667-69 Clement X 1670-76 Innocent XI 1676-89 Alexander VIII 1689-91 Innocent XII 1691-1700 Clement XI 1700-1721 Innocent XIII 1721-24 Benedict XIII 1724-30 Clement XII 1730-40 Benedict XIV 1740-58 Clement XIII 1758-69 Clement XIV 1769-74 Pius VI 1775-99 Pius VII 1800-1823 Leo XII 1823-29 Pius VIII 1829-30 Gregory XVI 1831-46 Pius IX 1846-78 Leo XIII 1878-1903 St. Pius X 1903-14 Benedict XV 1914-22 Pius XI 1922-39 Pius XII 1939-58 John XXIII 1958-63 Paul VI 1963-78 John Paul I 1978 John Paul II 1978-

The Concise Columbia Electronic Encyclopedia Copyright© 1994. Columbia University Press. Licensed from Lernout & Hauspie Speech Products N.V. All rights reserved.

Here they are Eugene.... count "em..... Now I'm outa here for good.

Goodbye Eugene John Et all. Been nice knowing ya. I think..

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), May 09, 2003.

You're out of your mind.

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), May 09, 2003.

Popes of the Roman Catholic Church

In the following list the date of election, rather than of consecration, is given. Before St. Victor I (189), dates may err by one year. Antipopes, those whose elections have been declared uncanonical, are indicated. Antipopes are those associated with the great Cataclysm and ruled in the Byzantine Empire.

St. Peter d. 64? or 67? St. Linus 67?-76? St. Cletus or Anacletus 76?-88? St. Clement I 88?-97? St. Evaristus 97?-105? St. Alexander I 105?-115? St. Sixtus I 115?-125? St. Telesphorus 125?-136? St. Hyginus 136?-140? St. Pius I 140?-155? St. Anicetus 155?-166? St. Soter 166?-175? St. Eleutherius 175?-189? St. Victor I 189-99 St. Zephyrinus 199-217 St. Calixtus I antipope: St. Hippolytus 217-22 217-35 St. Urban I 222-30 St. Pontian 230-35 St. Anterus 235-36 St. Fabian 236-50 St. Cornelius antipope: Novatian 251-53 251 St. Lucius I 253-54 St. Stephen I 254-57 St. Sixtus II 257-58 St. Dionysius 259-68 St. Felix I 269-74 St. Eutychian 275-83 St. Caius 283-96 St. Marcellinus 296-304 St. Marcellus I c.308-309 St. Eusebius 309-c.310 St. Miltiades or Melchiades, 311-14 St. Sylvester I 314-35 St. Marcus 336 St. Julius I 337-52 Liberius antipope: Felix 352-66 355-65 St. Damasus I antipope: Ursinus 366-84 366-67 St. Siricius 384-99 St. Anastasius I 399-401 St. Innocent I 401-17 St. Zosimus 417-18 St. Boniface I antipope: Eulalius 418-22 418-19 St. Celestine I 422-32 St. Sixtus III 432-40 St. Leo I 440-61 St. Hilary 461-68 St. Simplicius 468-83 St. Felix III (or II) 483-92 St. Gelasius I 492-96 Anastasius II 496-98 St. Symmachus antipope: Lawrence 498-514 498-505 St. Hormisdas 514-23 St. John I 523-26 St. Felix IV (or III) 526-30 Boniface II 530-32 pope or antipope: Dioscurus 530 John II 533-35 St. Agapetus I 535-36 St. Silverius 536-37 Vigilius 537-55 Pelagius I 556-61 John III 561-74 Benedict I 575-79 Pelagius II 579-90 St. Gregory I 590-604 Sabinian 604-6 Boniface III 607 St. Boniface IV 608-15 St. Deusdedit or Adeodatus I 615-18 Boniface V 619-25 Honorius I 625-38 Severinus 640 John IV 640-42 Theodore I 642-49 St. Martin I 649-55 St. Eugene I 654-57 St. Vitalian 657-72 Adeodatus II 672-76 Donus 676-78 St. Agatho 678-81 St. Leo II 682-83 St. Benedict II 684-85 John V 685-86 Conon antipope: Theodore antipope: Paschal 686-87 687 687 St. Sergius I 687-701 John VI 701-5 John VII 705-7 Sisinnius 708 Constantine 708-15 St. Gregory II 715-31 St. Gregory III 731-41 St. Zacharias 741 -52 Stephen II 752 (never consecrated) Stephen II (or III) 752-57 St. Paul I antipope: Constantine antipope: Philip 757-67 767-69 768 Stephen III (or IV) 768-72 Adrian I 772-95 St. Leo III 795-816 Stephen IV (or V) 816-17 St. Paschal I 812-24 Eugene II 824-27 Valentine 827 Gregory IV antipope: John 827-44 844 Sergius II 844-47 St. Leo IV 847-55 Benedict III antipope: Anastasius 855-58 855 St. Nicholas I 858-67 Adrian II 867-72 John VIII 872-82 Marinus I 882-84 St. Adrian III 884-85 Stephen V (or VI) 885-91 Formosus 891-96 Boniface VI 896 Stephen VI (or VII) 896-97 Romanus 897 Theodore II 897 John IX 898-900 Benedict IV 900-903 Leo V antipope: Christopher 903 903-4 Sergius III 904-11 Anastasius III 911-13 Lando 913-14 John X 914-28 Leo VI 928 Stephen VII (or VIII) 928-31 John Xl 931-35 Leo VII 936-39 Stephen VIII (or IX) 939-42 Marinus II 942-46 Agapetus II 946-55 John XII 955-64 Leo VIII or Benedict V (one of these was an antipope) 963-65 964-66 John XIII 965-72 Benedict VI antipope: Boniface VII 973-74 974, 984-85 Benedict VII 974-83 John XIV 983-84 John XV 985-96 Gregory V antipope: John XVI 996-99 997-98 Sylvester II 999-1003 John XVII 1003 John XVIII 1004-9 Sergius IV 1009-12 Benedict VIII antipope: Gregory 1012-24 1012 John XIX 1024-32 Benedict IX 1032-44 Sylvester III 1045 Benedict IX 1045 Gregory VI 1045-46 Clement II 1046-47 Benedict IX 1047-48 Damasus II 1048 St. Leo IX 1049-54 Victor II 1055-57 Stephen IX (or X) antipope: Benedict X 1057-58 1058-59 Nicholas II 1059-61 Alexander II antipope: Honorius II 1061-73 1061-72 St. Gregory VII antipope: Clement III 1073-85 1080-1100 Victor III 1086-87 Urban II 1088-99 Paschal II antipope: Theodoric antipope: Albert antipope: Sylvester IV 1099-1118 1100 1102 1105-11 Gelasius II antipope: Gregory VIII 1118-19 1118-21 Calixtus II 1119-24 Honorius II antipope: Celestine II 1124-30 1124 Innocent II antipope: Anacletus II antipope: Victor IV 1130-43 1130-38 1138 Celestine II 1143-44 Lucius II 1144-45 Eugene III 1145-53 Anastasius IV 1153-54 Adrian IV 1154-59 Alexander III antipope: Victor IV antipope: Paschal III antipope: Calixtus III antipope: Innocent III 1159-81 1159-64 1164-68 1168-78 1179-80 Lucius III 1181-85 Urban III 1185-87 Gregory VIII 1187 Clement III 1187-91 Celestine III 1191-98 Innocent III 1198-1216 Honorius III 1216-27 Gregory IX 1227-41 Celestine IV 1241 Innocent IV 1243-54 Alexander IV 1254-61 Urban IV 1261-64 Clement IV 1265-68 Gregory X 1271-76 Innocent V 1276 Adrian V 1276 John XXI 1276-77 Nicholas III 1277-80 Martin IV 1281-85 Honorius IV 1285-87 Nicholas IV 1288-92 St. Celestine V 1294 Boniface VIII 1294-1303 Benedict XI 1303-4 Clement V 1304-14 John XXII antipope: Nicholas V 1316-34 1328-30 Benedict XII 1334-42 Clement VI 1342-52 Innocent VI 1352-62 Urban V 1362-70 Gregory XI 1370-78 THE GREAT SCHISM 1378-1417 Roman Line Urban VI 1378-89 Boniface IX 1389-1404 Innocent VII 1404-6 Gregory XII 1406-15 Avignon Line antipope: Clement VII 1378-94 antipope: Benedict XIII 1394-1423 antipope: Clement VII 1423-29 antipope: Benedict XIV 1425-30 Pisan Line antipope: Alexander V 1409-10 antipope: John XXIII 1410-15 Martin V 1417-31 Eugene IV antipope: Felix V 1431-47 1439-49 Nicholas V 1447-55 Calixtus III 1455-58 Pius II 1458-64 Paul II 1464-71 Sixtus IV 1471-84 Innocent VIII 1484-92 Alexander VI 1492-1503 Pius III 1503 Julius II 1503-13 Leo X 1513-21 Adrian VI 1522-23 Clement VII 1523-34 Paul III 1534-49 Julius III 1550-55 Marcellus II 1555 Paul IV 1555-59 Pius IV 1559-65 St. Pius V 1566-72 Gregory XIII 1572-85 Sixtus V 1585-90 Urban VII 1590 Gregory XIV 1590-91 Innocent IX 1591 Clement VIII 1592-1605 Leo XI 1605 Paul V 1605-21 Gregory XV 1621-23 Urban VIII 1623-44 Innocent X 1644-55 Alexander VII 1655-67 Clement IX 1667-69 Clement X 1670-76 Innocent XI 1676-89 Alexander VIII 1689-91 Innocent XII 1691-1700 Clement XI 1700-1721 Innocent XIII 1721-24 Benedict XIII 1724-30 Clement XII 1730-40 Benedict XIV 1740-58 Clement XIII 1758-69 Clement XIV 1769-74 Pius VI 1775-99 Pius VII 1800-1823 Leo XII 1823-29 Pius VIII 1829-30 Gregory XVI 1831-46 Pius IX 1846-78 Leo XIII 1878-1903 St. Pius X 1903-14 Benedict XV 1914-22 Pius XI 1922-39 Pius XII 1939-58 John XXIII 1958-63 Paul VI 1963-78 John Paul I 1978 John Paul II 1978-

The Concise Columbia Electronic Encyclopedia Copyright© 1994. Columbia University Press. Licensed from Lernout & Hauspie Speech Products N.V. All rights reserved.

Here they are Eugene.... count "em..... Now I'm outa here for good.

Goodbye Eugene John Et all. Been nice knowing ya. I think..

-- Ed Richards (loztra@yahoo.com), May 09, 2003.