All Catholics Going to Hell

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The Roman Catholic Church is the cult of Satan. This cult has deceived a billion+ people and is leading them to Hell. They worship bread (eucharist) and call it Jesus. They pray to dead people and a pagan goddess called Isis (known as the Virgin Mary, Mother of God, Queen of Heaven to Catholic). Their doctrines are unbiblical and people need to be told the truth. "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." - Jesus Christ (John 14:6)

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), July 07, 2003

Answers

The Vatican is a political organization. They don't know God, but they blaspheme Him in every way.



-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), July 07, 2003.


I'm sitting in my chair laughing and shaking my head in disbelief.

I wonder who made you the supreme authority to judge? Who raised you onto the holy altar as one fit to weigh and measure the value of men? Who passed onto you the right to condemn others for eternity?

I hope that God finds some way to soften your heart to see HIS truth. I pray that you one day realize that your own disgust and dislike for something does not entitle you to condemn it in the name of God.

You, Mr. Ortiz are not God. I doubt that you know God in your life. Reading books and memorizing passages does not make you his spokesman on earth. It does not qualify you to decide the worth of others...

-- The Roamer (The_Roamer69@hotmail.com), July 14, 2003.


"I wonder who made you the supreme authority to judge?"

"And he said unto me...He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. but the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death" (Rev. 21:5, 7-8)

"Who raised you onto the holy altar as one fit to weigh and measure the value of men? Who passed onto you the right to condemn others for eternity?"

Obviously you don’t know the meaning of the word 'judge'. Am I condemning? No. I am only saying what the bible says.

"You, Mr. Ortiz are not God."

I never said I was a god. Stop assuming, we all know what happens when we ass/u/me.

"I doubt that you know God in your life".

"Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?" Galatians 4:16

Reading books and memorizing passages does not make you his spokesman on earth.

And sitting on a golden throne (pope) doesn’t make you his spokesman either.

The truth is intolerant. 2+2 always equals 4 regardless of whether you want it to equal 5 or 6. Jesus Christ is the only way to God and there's no other way.

John 14:6, Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

That means praying to dead people and Mary won’t help.

I pray that the Lord may open your eyes, and soften your heart. I pray that he leads you out of a false religion and into his True Church, The Church of Christ. No personal attacks please. God Bless

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), July 14, 2003.


so, is St Thomas Aquinas in Hell?

St Augustine?

St Peter, St Paul, etc

ALL Catholics.

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 08, 2004.


what about the Catholics who gave us the Bible? the writers. the scribes. the translators.

are they in Hell, too.

if they are, how can you trust Scripture?

pls explain.

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 08, 2004.



Ahhh, but David we do not pray to dead people. We request the prayers of LIVING -- living with God that is.

Did you know there's a scripture reference in the N.T. about "baptisms for the dead"? If you wanna see it, I'll find it. But I'm too lazy to look for it if you're not interested.

Gail

-- Gail (rothfarms@socket.net), January 08, 2004.


With due fairness, and though I disagree with David's "Catholics are ging to Hell" sentement, Peter and Paul where not nessisarily Catholic, and form a protestant , r secular, perspective wthe Cahtolic Churhc had yet to come about at the time. David beign an evident protestant more htan likely adheres to a seperate view, not oen that calls all early Christasn catholic.

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), April 30, 2004.

David may have changed his mind as nearly a year has passed since he first pronounced eternal damnation on all Catholics!

as regards the first Catholics, well Our Lord atoned for all, he opened up the gates to all, he founded a catholic church that today we know as the Catholic Church, reflecting its universality.

that Church has since sailed a choppy sea. it survived vile persecution by Domitian and others. it slowly consumed Rome and replaced pagan dates with Christian dates. it sorted out the heresies (Arianism, Nestorius, etc). it organised itself, especially by use of Councils to preserve the orthodoxy and uniformity of the faith. it "developped" doctrine that are not clear on the face of Scripture, such as the Blessed Trinity. it protected the early Tradition of the Church. and it did all this inspired by the Holy Ghost who will be with the Bride of Christ until the end of time.

in the 16th century, a new sort of heresy arose, one that was eventually to leave a real scar on the face of Christianity. it purported to empower each individual to the exclusion of the Holy Spirit. having ousted the role of the Holy Spirit in individuals' lives, ancient beliefs, such as Reverence for the Real Presence were chucked in the bin. (see St Justin's account, written during the second generation of Christianity: its historical, its not a theological treatise; and its very clear.)

amongst the so-called "reformers", the best known was a Marian Devotee.

later reformers chucked that in the bin too.

and on we go. more and more division. more individuals who think they know better than the 2,000 year old Church founde by Our Lord. individuls who think they are proficient translators of ancient languages, who think they are looking at source documentation, who think that they know more than some of the greatest thinkers that have ever lived (such as St Thomas Aquinas), who think the are experts on ex tempore culture,........, i consider it simply arrogant.

still today, we have the Catholic Church, the one world-class organisation that opposed Communism (organised atheism) and Nazism (organised paganism) openly. we now still openly oppose abortion, gay marriage/ priesthood, etc. the Holy Father seemed to be the only person who opposed Iraq - what a complete disaster that has been, he was right -- on moral grounds.

the Church is a beacon of morality in a world of darkness. but all thise private theologians/ linguists/ historians know better - don't they now.

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), May 01, 2004.


http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0071/0071_01.asp

-- Henry (HenryJ525@dodgeit.com), July 07, 2004.

Oh look... a Chick Tract...How quaint...

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), July 08, 2004.


Really, a whole packet of slander against the Church! Wow, thanks Henry. Nevermind that this guy has no proof whatsoever for his charges. Just the fact that he complied it against the Church must mean it's true . . . right?

Give me a break!

Gail

-- Gail (Rothfarms@socket.net), July 08, 2004.


Chick has a lot fo Tracs agaisnt Cahtolisism, and a boo thats aailable for free in etext called "Smokescreens" and several full length "Alberto" comics.

I htink he wants to convne you by Bulk...

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), July 08, 2004.


I'm sorry if I offended anyone, but I really don't know anything about Catholicism. If what that tract says is true, then Catholic's beliefs differ vastly from my own (I'm Methodist). I've never heard about Purgatory in church or in the Bible. Where did the idea of Purgatory come from? Do you really believe that bread or wafer is God? I'm not even sure if all Catholics are Roman Catholic. Are there different types of Catholics?

Sorry for all the questions, but I've never learned about Catholicism in church. We've discussed Jehova's Witnesses, Mormons, Judaism etc. but never Catholics.

-- Henry (HenryJ525@dodgeit.com), July 09, 2004.


Are there any Chick tracts written about the Methodist?

................................

-- rod (elreyrod@yahoo.com), July 09, 2004.


Chick is a Nondednominational Fundamentalist. So no... since he writes he Bilk of the tracts himself none are written by a Meathodist. Leats of all since the Meathodists now endoruse Gat clergy.

Nonetheless, Chikc uses manipulation tactics to distort what Catholics beleive and why, as well as les than repuable sources. ( Such as "DR." Alberto rivera, the supposed ex Jesuit who learned how Cathlisism was behond the Nazi's, the communits, and the Freemasons. Not to mention how the Vatican truns the worlds finanses and is attemptign to take poliitcal controle of the entire globe... )

Chick does get a lot of his facts right, btu his presentaiton fo them is in a bad light. This is a standard tatic in Manipulative liturature. He offers somhint hat, if investrgated wll b confirmed, but offers it in such a way as to present it as senester so as to plant the seeds ot hatred or suspicion in the ninds of those who read his tracts. Therefore, when one rads how the eucharist is th Literal Body of Jesus form a caholic Source, after firts hearign it frm Jack CHick, they will be lead to conclud Chick is 100% correct in how he depicts cahtolics in general. This isn't so, as the thological concepts held by Cahtlics or their beelif int he eucharist can also be explaiend in posiitve terms, or , better still, in Neutral temrms. Chikc diliberatly word htins in a way as to present ngative ramifications, but at the same time is creful nto to completely invent most of the spacifics. This way, if you are presented with the facts, your midn is alreatd primed to interpret it throh the lesons yu learned form chick.He offers some misinformation as well., such as his rather weak dissertation on hisotry and politics and Cahtolic invvlement, which are baic scare tactics and conspiracy theorising. Just liek the " Man neve lande don the Moon" and " Jesus was a myth, stolen form the pagans", his conspiracy theries, thuh the most elaborate and concrete I hav ever seen, employ the same sort of back tracjong, circular reasoning, and leaps f logic that , quiet frankly, render them hard to beelive.

Chick is not a viable soruc eon Roman Cahtolisism.

Likewise, not all Cahtolic belong tot he orman rite, amongCatholics who ar ein Communion withthe Pope, we also have the Eastern rite, as well as a few scatered rites, eahc with a uniqe litergy and slightly different rules for ordenation of Preists, sacramental delivery, ect.

All this said, I am not cahtolic.

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), July 09, 2004.



I think Chick is a Calvinist ;-)

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), July 09, 2004.

No Rod, Chick doesn't seem to have tracts on any Protestant denomination.

I also have to clarify on me being Methodist. I'm not really one. I just said that so it would be quicker for you to see where I'm coming from. I attend the Salvation Army, of which I'm sure you're all aware of. The founders were both Methodist, but our beliefs differ slightly.

Here's a non-biased description from infoplease.com:

The beliefs of the Army as set forth in the Handbook of Salvation Army Doctrine (1926) generally agree with those of most Protestant evangelical denominations, but the sacraments of baptism and the Lord's Supper are not considered essential to salvation and are not practiced. Great emphasis is placed on the experience of salvation and purity of life. In conducting the meetings officers are allowed great freedom, as no form of service is required; bands and singing are important features.

You can view the entire document here: http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/society/A0860902.html

You can view our doctrines here: http://www.salvationist.org/Extranet_main.nsf/0/A98A5A4B56A0D43A80256 CD8002F8126?openDocument

Since Chick seems to be a skewed source on Catholicism, where might I find a neutral source? All this has piqued my interest.

-- Henry (HenryJ525@dodgeit.com), July 09, 2004.


Henry,

You can find sources here:

www.aomin.org

www.christiantruth.com

www.ntrmin.org

www.carm.org

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), July 09, 2004.


I tend to have a morbid sense of curiousity. I've read through quite a number of them Chick trash.....uh, tracts. Yellow Journalism, propaganda, and smut come to mind when I try to find terms to describe Chick's fodder. The author and publisher of those tracts reminds me of a loose cannon rolling down the hill that is populated by innocent people just waiting to get blasted by one of those cannon balls. Of course, they won't get blasted unless they do their homework and realize the falsehoods in those volleys.

.......................

-- rod (elreyrod@yahoo.com), July 09, 2004.


Oh my gosh, David, could you give poor Henry any more ardent anti- Catholic bigotries than THESE?

Henry, go to Catholic.com and read what Catholics REALLY believe.

Gail

-- Gail (Rothfarms@socket.net), July 09, 2004.


Actually, yes I can.

Henry, you can also check out these sites.

www.monergism.com

www.gospeloutreach.net

www.gty.org

www.justforcatholics.org

www.letusreason.org

www.ligonier.org

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), July 10, 2004.


Henry,

It's up to you to decide. Gail has a problem with me showing and informing you about these sites, but if you want to know the truth, you need to see both sides.

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), July 10, 2004.


No personal attacks please.

-- (Christian_Moderator@@hotmail.com), July 10, 2004.


If you are interested in the truth about what the Catholic Church teaches, there is no better place to look than the Catechism of the Catholic Church, which can be found here:

http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc.htm

Also, www.ewtn.com is another good source of Catholic teaching.

Also, you might want to read some of the dialogues that the Catholic Church has had with other denominations, such as Evangelicals and Catholics Together. These dialogues usually present a fair picture of what each side believes. There seem to be a lot of sites that discuss Catholicism that are not interested in fairness.

I think that was the concern that Gail had.

-- James (stinkcat_14@hotmail.com), July 10, 2004.


Yes, reading (or actually hearing) debates would be the best thing to do. Both sides are there, and can say when and *if* the person is misrepresenting them.

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), July 10, 2004.

I'm all for debates if the opponents are well matched. I hate hearing a theologian debate a layperson. Not fair. I fear that some of the sites David mentions like to tell "us Catholics what we believe," which is usually either their misconception or an outright lie and then proceed to slay-their-manmade-dragon.

Here's another good website for debates. http://www.bringyou.to/apologetics/apolog.htm

God Bless,

Gail

-- Gail (Rothfarms@socket.net), July 11, 2004.


Looks like I have a lot of reading to catch up on!

I'll try to read a bit of both sides when I have some time. Thanks for all the links.

-- Henry (HenryJ525@dodgeit.com), July 12, 2004.


Please people get real. I e-mailed Gail. I would surely think shell have a glorious foolish comeback, cant wait to see it. When a RC says alone is my interpetation, then I have a 5 yr. old grandaughter ready to debate you. that clearly says where your discernemt lies. That would be with the Master of confusion and lies. RC put their faith in their FAITH. Sorry, but that will buy you a one way ticket to hell. YOur only hope then is that you dont drop dead. because if you do, your new home will be waiting for you, and it will be very hot, count on it. If you dont get this right BEFORE you take your last breath, YOU ARE TOAST, you can take that to the bank. but go ahead, Make Gods day, stay in rebellion to truth, he will not remove the veil of deception, until you sincerely are ready for truth. But as I said, dont think you get to debate with god after that last breath, It isnt gonna happen. Pray for discernment, get a good study bible, stop listening to the lying RC church and its lying leaders. Stop being so lazy. Pray for wisdom and discernment. PUt 100% trust in Jesus for salvation, NOTHING ELSE, I said NOTHING ELSE. MEAN IT, form your heart, not just your mouth and head. Repent, ask God to forgive your foolish stubborness and brainwashed head and he will SHOW you truth, but before that, YOU ARE NOT GOING TO RECEIVE IT, I guarantee it. Once you learn truth, RUN out the Whore and get in the word, the bible the one your lying church likes tio tell you isnt the sole source of truth, Oh god just LOVES that one, the nasty liars, seek HIM for truth, NOT MAN, any man and he will aid you with the HOLY SPIRIT. The HOLY SPIRIT will give you the POWER to overcome fear of leaving your lying church, ( you are afraid It is a cult, they have trained you to be afraid) but the Holy spirit will not give you a spirit of Fear, but of LOve, POWER and a SOUND MIND ( one can discern error, one which you do not have right now) once he does that. GET OUT OF THE WHORE. dont take my word for any of this, stop being so lazy, and start seeking HIm and truth, as I said, if you are 100% sincere in wanting it, he will gladly give it you, once he knows you will accept it. god does not give this precious gift to just anyone, just those who sincerely want it. Do YOU WANT TRUTH, or NOT? That is totally UP TO YOU, ONLY YOU. Break free from Satans strings YOU CAN DO IT!!!!!!!!!!! GO for it.

-- Beth O'Day (BAogeo69@aol.com), September 12, 2004.

Beth,

I disagree.

-- Jim (furst@flash.net), September 12, 2004.


Hi Beth.

Welcome to the forum. May I suggest a few moments in meditation and quiet? I agree with Jim; I too disagree.

..................

-- rod (elreyrod@yahoo.com), September 12, 2004.


Beth and David: Your HATRED comes across loud and clear. Is hate a Christian value? Not in the Catholic Church; I don't know what your church teaches. Cathy

-- Cathy Meighen (peacewv@yahoo.com), September 25, 2004.

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