"We live in perilous times: we are passing through a most eventful period; the Christian World is convulsed; there is a mighty upheaval of the old foundations of faith; a great overhauling of old teaching. The Bible is being made to speak to-day in a language which to our fathers would be an unknown tongue.

"We would greatly object to the sniffing about for heresy which some speak of; but in this case the heresy is avowed, and is thrust forward in no diffident style.

"A new religion has been initiated, which is no more Christianity than chalk is cheese; and this religion, being destitute of moral honesty, palms itself off as the old faith with slight improvements, and on this plea usurps pulpits which were erected for Gospel preaching. The atonement is scouted, the inspiration of Scripture is derided, the Holy Spirit is degraded into an influence, the punishment of sin is turned into fiction, and the resurrection into a myth, and yet these enemies of our faith expect us to call the brethren, and maintain a confederacy with them.

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 20, 2004

Answers

who he?

-- Ian (ib@vertfigo.com), January 20, 2004.

I am willing to bet that is probably not a Christian and you are just trying to make Christians look bad. Is it one of your favorite non-Christian cultists Jim Jones or David Koresh? Or Gene Robinson?

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), January 20, 2004.

Dave

no-one need look bad in this. everyone can introduce a quote and see who can guess who its from.

if even only 5 people produce quotes from chrisians, we might learn something about each other.

that's the point.

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 20, 2004.

Name this Christian:

"I am in receipt of the mass card you sent to me in June. As I’m sure you expect, I’m not writing to say “thank you.” It would be fundamentally inconsistent of me to ever give thanks for the offering of a mass, since my study of God’s Holy Word has convinced me the Roman Mass is a blasphemy against the cross of my Lord Jesus Christ. It accomplishes nothing, outside of perpetuating the myths of transubstantiation and a sacramental priesthood. I have a theory I know why this took place, and who was behind it, but I assure you that I need no medieval religious rite to make my “intentions” known to God. As a Christian I am invited to boldly come before the throne of grace (Hebrews 4:16), not by any righteousness of my own, but solely by the righteousness of Jesus Christ. I look to Him, and Him alone, as the one who can save me “completely” since He ever lives to make intercession for me (Hebrews 7:24-25), not by being transubstantiated into wine and a wafer on an altar, but by the one offering of His perfect sacrifice on Calvary. Instead of appearing on Roman altars, my Lord Jesus is ever in the presence of the Father, interceding for me (Hebrews 9:12, 24). He is seated there, His work of sacrifice being accomplished (Hebrews 10:12), with the result that all those for whom He died are perfected by His work in their behalf (Hebrews 10:14). The Roman Mass is not a “re- presentation” of that one sacrifice, as you claim, for it does not result in the perfection of anyone.

I continue to pray that God will be merciful in showing you all the power of His grace, the truth of His gospel. And since my God is not dependent upon the actions or sacraments of men, I truly believe my request is infinitely greater than any offering of masses for the “intentions” of myself or anyone else. I do hope you will come to know that.

In the service of the risen Christ,"

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), January 20, 2004.

Is it spurgeon?

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), January 20, 2004.

well done!!

now you see my point.

it could have been a Catholic, a protestant, a Calvinist, a JW,.....

if no-one else can be bothered, i am happy to dig out a few more.

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 20, 2004.

http://www.aomin.org/MassCard.html

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 20, 2004.

"Line dancing is as sinful as any other type of dancing, with its sexual gestures and touching. It is an incitement to lust."

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 20, 2004.

"Let the gentleman go to Revelation to learn the decree of God - let him go to the Bible. . . . I said that slavery was sanctioned in the Bible, authorized, regulated, and recognized from Genesis to Revelation. . . . Slavery existed then in the earliest ages, and among the chosen people of God; and in Revelation we are told that it shall exist till the end of time shall come. You find it in the Old and New Testaments - in the prophecies, psalms, and the epistles of Paul; you find it recognized - sanctioned everywhere."

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 20, 2004.

" Serpents and monkeys are subjected to demons more than other animals. The devil lives in them and possesses them. He uses them to deceive men and to injure them. "

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 21, 2004.

Ian,

I have no idea who said the above. They are interesting quotes. I like the "name that Christian" idea. Hope you'll eventually reveal the sources. Not yet though,... still time to see if someone knows.

-- Jim Furst (furst@flash.net), January 21, 2004.

"Line dancing is as sinful as any other type of dancing, with its sexual gestures and touching. It is an incitement to lust"

Ian Paisley?

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), January 21, 2004.

"Let the gentlemen..."

Jefferson Davis

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), January 21, 2004.

" Serpents and monkeys are subjected to demons more than other animals. The devil lives in them and possesses them. He uses them to deceive men and to injure them. "

Agh, the unmentionables' Idol, anti-semitic Luther!

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), January 21, 2004.

you are very good at thos David!

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 22, 2004.

"Ask a baby about the ordination of women, about divorce legislation, violence on television, who will win the election; it is not a fruitful experience.

........

This is the solitude of truth, the solitude, finally, of God; God as a spastic child who can communicate nothing but his presence and his inarticulate wanting."

-- Ian (ib@vertigo.com), January 22, 2004.

Another one:

"A church that suffers no persecution but enjoys the privileges and support of the things of the earth—beware!—is not the true church of Jesus Christ."

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 22, 2004.

"...an adventure is an inconvenience rightly considered"

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 26, 2004.

"Kind words can be short and easy to speak, but their echoes are truly endless."

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 29, 2004.

"I have found the paradox, that if you love until it hurts, there can be no more hurt, only more love."

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 29, 2004.

"Take the first step in faith. You don't have to see the whole staircase, just take the first step."

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 29, 2004.

"Good can exist without evil, whereas evil cannot exist without good."

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), January 30, 2004.

"Ask a baby about the ordination of women..."
Don't know.
"This is the solitude of truth, the solitude, finally..."
Don't know.
"A church that suffers no persecution but enjoys the privileges"
Don't know.
"...an adventure is an inconvenience rightly considered"
Don't know
"Kind words can be short and easy to speak, but their echoes are truly endless"
Mother Theresa
"I have found the paradox, that if you love until it hurts, there can be no more hurt, only more love"
Mother Theresa
"Take the first step in faith. You don't have to see the whole staircase, just take the first step"
Dr. King
"Good can exist without evil, whereas evil cannot exist without good"
Don't know.

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), January 31, 2004.

"Most High, all-powerful, all-good Lord, All praise is Yours, all glory, all honour and all blessings. To you alone, Most High, do they belong, and no mortal lips are worthy to pronounce Your Name.

Praised be You my Lord with all Your creatures, especially Sir Brother Sun, Who is the day through whom You give us light. And he is beautiful and radiant with great splendour, Of You Most High, he bears the likeness.

Praised be You, my Lord, through Sister Moon and the stars, In the heavens you have made them bright, precious and fair.

Praised be You, my Lord, through Brothers Wind and Air, And fair and stormy, all weather's moods, by which You cherish all that You have made.

Praised be You my Lord through Sister Water, So useful, humble, precious and pure.

Praised be You my Lord through Brother Fire, through whom You light the night and he is beautiful and playful and robust and strong.

Praised be You my Lord through our Sister, Mother Earth who sustains and governs us, producing varied fruits with coloured flowers and herbs.

Praise be You my Lord through those who grant pardon for love of You and bear sickness and trial. Blessed are those who endure in peace, By You Most High, they will be crowned.

Praised be You, my Lord through Sister Death, from whom no-one living can escape. Woe to those who die in mortal sin! Blessed are they She finds doing Your Will. No second death can do them harm.

Praise and bless my Lord and give Him thanks, And serve Him with great humility."

PS Ortiz

why is this in the "False Religions" category?!?!?!

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), February 14, 2004.

No clue. Whoever made the thread put it in there.

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), February 14, 2004.

A Jesuit may be shortly described as an empty suit of clothes with another person living in them, who acts for him, thinks for him, decides for him whether he shall be a prince or a beggar, and moves him about wheresoever he pleases; who allows him to exhibit the internal aspect of a man, but leaves him none of the privileges – no liberty, no property, no affections, not even the power to refuse obedience when ordered to commit the most atrocious of crimes; for, the more he outrages his own feelings, the greater his merits. Obedience to the superior is his only idea of virtue, and in all other respects he is a mere image.

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), February 14, 2004.

"I believe in God like I believe in the sun rise. Not because I can see it, but because I can see all that it touches."

-- Ian (ib@vertifgo.com), February 14, 2004.