CoC and DoC

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Kevin, last night at Richland Hills Church of Christ, the preacher Rick had invited 3 pews' worth of church of Christ and Disciples of Christ members, most from academic institutions, to attend assembly with Richland Hills. The lesson was given by Dave Faust (Christian Church). Is there a "cease fire" treaty in the making?

-- Luke Juarez (hubertdorm@yahoo.com), June 03, 2004

Answers

bump

-- David Ortiz (cyberpunk1986@hotmail.com), June 03, 2004.

Rick Atchley and Max Lucado seem to be shaking some hands with the DoC. I don't think the purpose is to form one church, but to form one mission. Rick said last night that he felt this pressing on his heart.

-- Luke Juarez (hubertdorm@yahoo.com), June 03, 2004.

Luke,

I wouldn't believe ANYTHING these two FALSE teachers are promoting.

Check out this link:

Rick Atchley

-- Kevin Walker ("kevinlwalker572@cs.com"), June 03, 2004.


Could you imagine believing that music is a bad thing or that God doesn't want us to sing of our great joy in Him? Lol!!

It's like believing that alcohol itself is evil--rather than understanding that it is the resulting drunkeness.....that is the problem.

-- ("faith01@myway.com"), June 03, 2004.


The churc of CHrist does sing, it just doesnt allow insturmental Music...

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), June 05, 2004.


Some of the larger, progressive ones offer optional instrumental services Zarove. The main differences between CoC and DoC are ecumenical and instrumental

-- Luke Juarez (hubertdorm@yahoo.com), June 05, 2004.

Actually, it's the Christian Church, not the Disciples of Christ that Rick and Max have been reaching out to. I misspoke. Just clearing things up. Not that anyone cares lol.

-- Luke Juarez (hubertdorm@yahoo.com), February 09, 2005.

i have never actually studied about music in the church. zarove, faith and others, would you mind giving me your opinions on the use of music in your congregations?

1. musical instruments- do you use them, if so, what types of instruments, is there a "standard" so to say of what types of instruments are allowed? if no, what is the reasoning behind not using them, if yes, is there even a reason? like do you use them because it's biblical or because "everyone else is doing it"?

2. songs- do you use old songs, hymns, contemporary songs, songs that have a meaning or story, songs who's purpose is only to venerate God, songs that are for pulling on the heart strings to get an emotional response, who chooses the songs?

this post is not meant to start a debate on whether or not some types of music or some types of instruments should or should not be allowed, it is meant for information gathering purposes only. if anyone chooses to debate this, i don't mind, but can i please get some answers first?

-- rina (emailmarina@yahoo.com), February 09, 2005.


My Church uses mainly traditional hymns with pipe organ and choir. After Communion there is a period of meditation where anything from a Gregorian Chant to a piece by the great Lutheran composer J.S.Bach might be played. As a musician myself, I find liturgical music (a newly acquired taste for me) to be moving and helpful during that period of meditation. It enhances my experience of the Mass. For me it neither detracts or interferes. Some find music during services to be controversial, I see it as a gift that I appreciate.

-- Jim (furst@flash.net), February 09, 2005.

We use a lot of guitar and piano and some classical organ. We stick with our hymnals most of the time, but sometimes add some contemporary "heavy" worship songs according to the theme of the readings for that day.

We have virtually stripped Robin Mark's "Revival in Belfast" of songs like Lion of Judah, Be Unto Thy Name, Days of Elijah, How Great are Thou Lord, and on and on. We have now started in on Robin's 2nd CD "Come Heal this Land" (Awesome Irish music with profound lyrics!) Our music director has "carte blanche" as our pastor completely trusts her. He is also youngish and likes the contemporary things we have added!

We love John Michael Talbot and use every song of his we can get our hands on. (Our hymnals have LOTS of Talbot) My favorite Catholic writer, besides Talbot, is M.D. Ridge. She's terrific! Her lyrics are POWERFUL!

-- Gail (rothfarms@socket.net), February 09, 2005.



Man, and you guys have gripes about Catholics here? Listen to this (from the link)

The method of Hegel, Hitler, Machiavelli and the modern CHANGE MOVEMENT is to lie and condemn the OLD SYSTEM. Once people are dissociated or put into schizophrenia, then you can impose your NEW STYLE WORSHIP. With music, this is as NEW as Lucifer in heaven and the end-time Babylon Whore of Revelation 18.

And this about music.

Btw, what is the difference between the COC and DOC?

Frank

-- Someone (ChimingIn@twocents.cam), February 09, 2005.


"You guys" ar emainly Catholics... this baord is primarly Cahtolic in populac ef late thanks to many defectign form Catholci firum, as this baord is muhc mfoe free to voiced Decent.

And the CHruch of Chrust is firmly opposed to Insturmental music.

The differences betwen the disiples and the Chruhc of Christ is that one uses instruments, the other doesnt.

That and a few other smaller differences exist, but bot beeliv ein he Need of baptism.

Its similar to Orthodox and Cahtolic scism. Both CHruhces origioanted it he same way but excommunicated each other.

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), February 10, 2005.


Well, I'm confused now. I've heard two different things.

One person told me that it is the Disciples of Christ that the Church of Christ has been fellowshiping with.

Someone else said it was the First Christian Church.

The Church of Christ is almost identical to the First Christian Church except that the latter uses instruments. Some congregations offer traditional and contemporary services. They both are autonomous and believe in baptism.

The Disciples of Christ (Christian Church) is similiar but also different. They take the Lord's Supper every Lord's day. They practice baptism by immersion but accept other methods as valid. I've never been to their services, but I'd imagine they use instruments.

Here is their website for more info: DoC

-- Luke Juarez (hubertdorm@yahoo.com), February 10, 2005.


O.k., just so I have it straight, the COC and DOC have the same general doctrine just the coc does NOT believe in instrumental music, and the DOC does, correct?

Frank

-- Someone (ChimingIn@twocents.cam), February 10, 2005.


Luke,

The Disciples of Christ broke away from the Christian Church and they are significantly more liberal than those in the Christian Church...

-- Kevin Walker ("navyscporetired@comcast.net"), February 10, 2005.



Isn't Max Lucado Church of Christ?

-- Gail (rothfarms@socket.net), February 10, 2005.

Gail

I got to thinking...restricted to what only benefits the forum

............

-- rod (elreyrod@yahoo.com), February 10, 2005.


Gail,

You wrote, "Isn't Max Lucado Church of Christ?"

He used to be but has long since departed from the faith...

The name of "his" church is no longer the "Oak Hills church of Christ" it is now the "Oak Hills church"...

-- Kevin Walker ("navyscporetired@comcast.net"), February 10, 2005.


Disiple of chirs also consider themselve sa Protesntant denominaiton, whereas the churhc of chirst rejects Denominaitnalism as divisive.

Disiples practice open comunion "To all who beleive in Jesus Crist as their Lord". Cruch of chirst nly to Baptsed members.

Disiples likewise tend to be more "Progressive" in social viess and moe ecuminial aming evangelical Protesntant grpups, Cruch of Christ is Isolationist.

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), February 10, 2005.


Hi Kevin, thanks for your response.

When you say that Max "departed from the faith," what exactly do you mean?

-- Gail (rothfarms@socket.net), February 10, 2005.


Gail,

I (and many others) consider this man to be a "false teacher"...

-- Kevin Walker ("navyscporetired@comcast.net"), February 10, 2005.


False because he uses instruments? Gee I hope not.

-- Luke Juarez (hubertdorm@yahoo.com), February 10, 2005.

omg music evil?

creeps!

ps.many catholic music and churches i find rather scary...just my opinion

-- sdqa (sdqa@sdqa.com), February 11, 2005.


Music composition has the value of it being a result or product of the composer's great devotion to God and the faith in God. This cannot be described as "scary" if one begins to understand the purpose of that music. What is "scary" is not knowing why sacred music exists in the first place.

.................

-- rod (elreyrod@yahoo.com), February 11, 2005.


Hi Kevin, Why? Max Lucado is a fabulous writer. What false teachings are you talking about?

-- Gail (rothfarms@socket.net), February 11, 2005.

The church's teaching on baptism is different from the church of Christ.

Oak Hills: Baptism

Still, they believe that baptism is a requirement of membership (Oak Hills Member Process). So in that aspect they function more like the SBC.

Max has been under-fire by several CoC members for his stance on baptism, and lack of emphasis. Truth is, in one year, Oak Hills will baptize more people than the critics combined.

-- Luke Juarez (hubertdorm@yahoo.com), February 11, 2005.


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