There is currenly a bill in the US Senate that if passed, will illegalize "therapeutic cloning". This is a technique that many scientists believe is the key to turning stem cell research into cures and treatments. If passed, practitioners can face up to a $1 million fine and up to 10 years in prison.

Now then. What are you guys' opinions on stem cell research? My opinion on stem cell research is that it can advance the medical field vastly. Yes, I support stem cell research. That is my stance.

-- Pasta (ilike@pasta.com), November 08, 2004

Answers

I don't really know how to feel about stem cell research. I think that killing children, unborn or not, is the worst thing you could possibly do, but with the current abortion laws in place, aborted fetuses could be obtained very easily, and dealt with. So consequently, with my belief that abortion is right in very, very specific cases, I think that stem cell research should continue, but by NO MEANS should embryos be grown specifically for the purpose of harvesting. That violates every single thing that humanity is about. It should continue with fetuses that have been aborted, because we can't just stop the march of science. That is, as well, wrong. Denying knowlege when it's right in front of you is the wrong way to go. This is the one place I agree with President Bush in. It should be allowed, but handled and controlled very, very carefully.

-- U msut Feers Me (Dubyalovesblow00@hotmail.com), November 08, 2004.

"I think that stem cell research should continue, but by NO MEANS should embryos be grown specifically for the purpose of harvesting."

I second that! I think the technology is progressing to cloning the cells and culturing them on a mass scale. Stopping the research will prevent cellular biologists from learning how to do that.

-- KOBE SBM (kobesbm@kobehq.com), November 09, 2004.

Stem Cells->Cure Disease=Good!
Stem Cells->Harvest Babies=Bad!

Cause if step a leads to step b, sooner or later, step c, harvesting of *real peoples* organs on a wide black market scale who cant afford some fake new liver will appear. And the poor mexicans illegal immigrants will suddenly be waking up in bathtubs of ice all over the country.

-- Kayce (kayce@hotmail.com), November 09, 2004.

Kerry made a good call on issues like this during the debates. He said that despite having Catholic faith, it's not his place to ram his ideals down the throat of the American public. With the benefits stem cell has to offer, I think that using embryos is justified. If they're going to be aborted any way, might as well get some use out of them. I wonder if Bush's (and every other opponent of stem cell research) stance would change if they got Parkinson's but it was shown that we could cure the disease within 5 years of widespread stem cell research.

One thing I've been looking for is some evidence to show when exactly life begins. According to a lot of Conservatives, it begins at the "moment of conception".

http://www.nrlc.org/abortion/wdlb/wdlb.html

In the STRICTEST scientific sense, perhaps. Life may have "began" on Earth in protoplasmic slop when proteins started binding together, etc. However, here's one thing I don't buy: "The question of when life begins is not a scientific question. It is a moral, ethical, philosophical, legal and theological question." How can you say WHEN life begins is a LEGAL question?

Anyways, regardless of when human life begins, I can't think of one GOOD reason to illegalize abortion or stem cell. Regardless of what your faith is or even if you don't have one, if you take away the right to abortion, people are just going to start doing it themselves. Take away stem cell in this country and people will just reap the benefits in other places. I say if the mom's going to abort her embryo/fetus, get some use out of it.

-- Pasta (alfredo@marinara.com), November 09, 2004.

I think everybody would agree that the legalization of reproductive cloning is a potential nightmare, I shudder to think of a never ending line of George Dubyas. therapeutic cloning will almost certainly open the door for reproductive cloning, contrary to what many people think we are some distance off practical human reproductive cloning due to inter species differences in DNA methylation patterns. But history has shown that although progress can be slowed by decree it is never stopped. I believe that knowledge has an intrinsic value but knowledge in the wrong hands can be dangerous. Banning reputable scientists form conducting research does not solve any problems, it’s like burying your head in the sand.

-- bromis (bromis@bioactive.org), November 09, 2004.

Dumbass.

-- (AKO's@Fuctard.com), November 10, 2004.

ITS ONLY YOU BEATING YOUR DICK AND CUMMING ON YOUR PLAYGIRL MAGAZINES CAUSE YOU CANT GET ANYTHING ANYWHERE ANYHOW YOU STUPID FUCKTARD

-- gjskl (hi-im-a-fucktard@named-abokath.cum), November 14, 2004.

Hey now, AKO has got some really good points for once on this thread.

I agree also that the desire by the religious kooks in this country are setting the US back in science yet again. These are the same people trying to dumb down general science and biology in schools to fit their warped beliefs.

-- Wes Kinsler (kinsler1@hotmail.com), November 15, 2004.

Hey now, AKO has got some really good points for once on this thread.

I agree also that the desire by the religious kooks in this country are setting the US back in science yet again. These are the same people trying to dumb down general science and biology in schools to fit their warped beliefs.

I agree with you, Wes. I think that just because a bunch of christians disagree with it morally, doesn't mean that it should be stopped. I mean, diseases that were incurable in the past could very soon be extinct. Think about it. Parkinsons? Gone. Alzhimers? Gone. How many others could we cure? But in turn, it needs to be taken very seriously. We cannot, for the sake of humanity, grow embryos to be harvested, and on the same token, we cannot completely stop this process. This is where I agree with President Bush on something. The march of science cannot be stopped when success is so near, but we have to tread carefully, human life is a dire thing to fiddle with. And fuck the schools who think evolution is a facade.

-- U msut Feers Me (Dubyalovesblowoo@hotmail.com), November 15, 2004.

I agree also that the desire by the religious kooks in this country are setting the US back in science yet again. These are the same people trying to dumb down general science and biology in schools to fit their warped beliefs

Another misled individual posting. A lot of our science is based on Christian scientists' discoveries, and even that of some Christian clergy, such as the monk Mendel's discovery of genetic transmission. Our public schools, now felt somehow to be an oasis of atheism actually started out in Massachussetts with the "devil deception act" or something like that in the 1600s, where the public was felt to need enough education to read the Bible. If anything the religious have been the keepers of knowledge and education more so than the secular societies they were in for most of history.

The "dumbing down" of our schools likewise came from anti-religious people, the secularists of the 60's who wanted everyone to do well for their "self-esteem", somehow thinking that someone feeling good about being ignorant is better than actually learning something even though their grades sucked. Not the fault of the religious though.

We cannot, for the sake of humanity, grow embryos to be harvested

This is a foolish thing to think. The U.S. already kills 1 MILLION of its children every year for convenience, when Ted Kennedy needs a new liver, and someone says "you know, you could get a NEW liver if you just let those embryos grow a bit before killing them anyway", how immoral do you think ol Chappaquiddick will think that is?

Never underestimate the ability of people to look the other way rather than standing up and doing what's right. If people don't mind allowing abortion, why do you think they'd mind getting back some "benefit" from themm?

Bazooka Joe

-- 2 (1@3.4), November 16, 2004.

Joe, I agree with most of that post, in that abortions should not be allowed for some dumb slut who got drunk at a party, forgot to take her pill, and got pregnant. If I was a doctor who had to deal with that, I'd simply go "Oh. Boo hoo, I feel so sorry for you. Tough shit. Have a happy 9 months!" And proceed to send her on her way. You're completely right, children shouldn't have to die because of an irrisponsible mother, but my feeling is that children who would be born with a crippling disease or severe brain damage, the kind of kids that would die before they turned 20, the kids who would spend all of their short lives in pain, and the kids who couldn't even function due to brain damage should be mercifully let go, before they even have to suffer a life like that. Stem cell research could proceed on with embryos in that kind of situation, but not as it is now, with chicks pumping out aborted fetuses. My main point was not to grow children just to kill them for their cells. We can't degrade into that.

-- U msut Feers Me (Dubyalovesblow00@hotmail.com), November 16, 2004.

Hitler did that, you know. Before beginning to kill Jews, he started with the retarded and "undesireables" in Germany. Once you start saying SOME life isn't worth living, it's not as difficult to say someone else's life isn't worth living either.

Also, I don't think they can use stem cells from babies with genetic diseases -- the whole point is to use NORMAL cells that will act NORMALLY. Make no mistake, stem cell research is code for "have a reason to continue abortion."

Bazooka Joe

-- 2 (1@3.4), November 17, 2004.

Joe, I didn't mean that we would kill off retarded kids. Fuck no. I know a few kids who have down syndrome, and they are some of the sweetest, nicest people around. I wouldn't dream of that. They aren't in pain, they can carry on a conversation, and they're damn fine productive members of society, in my mind, there is no difference in equality between me and them. However, I'm talking about the kids who will be born so brain damaged, or addicted to drugs, or have an STD from their mother, that they can't even function. The people who will do nothing but suffer... I know it's hard to draw the line, but this is the best I can do on both my stances on abortion and stem cell research... and last, I didn't say GENETIC disorders. Maybe I should have phrased that more carefully.

-- U msut Feers Me (Dubyalovesblow00@hotmail.com), November 17, 2004.

Joe,
If you would rather have children in school tought that the mathematical value of pi is 3 rather than 3.1415..., and that men and women have a different number of ribs, then you really need to check back into reality with the rest of us for a while.

That is the type of "learning" Christian scientists are lobbying to get into schools.

Yes, I aknowledge that there are scientists who also happen to be Christian, but notice that these scientists actually get their facts in the field and from expirament, and see the Bible as just a collection of fables and stories and not a reference for scientific knowledge.

That is what seperates Christian Scientists (and science educators) from real scientists, wether they be Christian or not.

-- Wes Kinsler (kinsler1@hotmail.com), November 18, 2004.

Wes,

I never claimed the Bible was a scientific reference work. I don't know anyone who does. The part agnostics or atheists misunderstand about religion, (hence why they are always wrong about it) is that the search for God is really a search for Truth.

One uses different tools for religion and science -- faith and prayer vs. experiment and deduction, but the GOAL is in many ways the same. Contrast that to someone who flatly denies anything they can't see or understand, how much drive do you think that person will have to go into the sciences as a field in the first place? What drive for understanding does that person show?

If you would rather have children in school tought that the mathematical value of pi is 3 rather than 3.1415..., and that men and women have a different number of ribs

Can you cite where some school district is teaching either of these? I doubt it. This is just religion bashing. Every couple of years some newspaper will run a study about how a lot of people believe that the sun moves around the earth, but you don't hear me bashing the public schools for it. At least I don't have to make things up to support my argument.

Bazooka jOe

-- 2 (1@3.4), November 18, 2004.