Now I really don't appreciate all the Protestant bashing, but hey this is a Catholic forum, so you will do as you wish. I'm pretty sure that I'm supposed to love and respect all, but hey what do I know right?

Anywho...

1) God's gift is eternal life through Jesus Christ, correct? Purgatory is where you go because you have to work off your sins, correct? The Bible states Jesus died for all your sins, correct? However in the past, pre-Reformation, the Catholic Church sold Indulgences so someone would not have to stay in purgatory the entire time, correct? So why then does peter make the following statement: Acts 8:20 20Peter answered: “May your money perish with you, because you thought you could buy the gift of God with money!...?

2) You believe that you have to be a part of the Catholic Church to go to Heaven. However first you must suffer through purgatory before you do. And you believe that there is no salvation outside the catholic Church why then does Paul comment the following: Acts 11:17 17So if God gave them the same gift as he gave us, who believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I to think that I could oppose God?”

3) You believe that you must do 'good works' to get time off of your stay in purgatory and to get into Heaven, but then why does Peter state the following: Acts: 15:7-11 (primarily focusing on 15:11) After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9He made no distinction between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of the disciples a yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear? 11No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”

4) When Paul and others were taken to prison and a prison guard saved them, doesn't Paul tel the guard: Acts 16:31 "31They replied, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved–you and your household.”

5) Again, wh is it so hard to accept people who are not Catholic: Romans 3:22 22This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference,

6) When was the last time a Protestant said they could be saved and that was it? Please read what the Bible states: Romans 3:31 31Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law. Again doesn't Jesus himself state: John 14:12 12I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.

7) What does the term Pope mean? I'm pretty sure from Latin it is some form of father correct? But doesn't Jesus in Matthew tell us: Matthew 23:9 9And do not call anyone on earth ‘father,’ for you have one Father, and he is in heaven

8) What Protestant tells you once s/he is saved it is over, game over, they win. Jesus himself tells us: Revelations 2:10 Do not be afraid of what you are about to suffer. I tell you, the devil will put some of you in prison to test you, and you will suffer persecution for ten days. Be faithful, even to the point of death, and I will give you the crown of life.

Thanks for answering any and al questions you can.

Haved a blessed day.

~jesse d.

-- Jesse D. (jessededeyne@hotmail.com), February 15, 2005

Answers

Now I really don't appreciate all the Protestant bashing, but hey this is a Catholic forum, so you will do as you wish. I'm pretty sure that I'm supposed to love and respect all, but hey what do I know right? Anywho...

{iT ONLY GETS BAD ON OCCASSION...especially when instituted by a torll.}-Zarove

1) God's gift is eternal life through Jesus Christ, correct? Purgatory is where you go because you have to work off your sins, correct? The Bible states Jesus died for all your sins, correct? However in the past, pre-Reformation, the Catholic Church sold Indulgences so someone would not have to stay in purgatory the entire time, correct? So why then does peter make the following statement: Acts 8:20 20Peter answered: “May your money perish with you, because you thought you could buy the gift of God with money!...?

False. Indlgences whee given as a form of earthy penance, not Purgetorial.

Also, purgetory is not where sins are worked off, btu rather washed awya with fire, in Cahtolci theology. Purgetory is more of a wiatign area, where you ar purified, btu you sont work dsns off.

2) You believe that you have to be a part of the Catholic Church to go to Heaven. However first you must suffer through purgatory before you do. And you believe that there is no salvation outside the catholic Church why then does Paul comment the following: Acts 11:17 17So if God gave them the same gift as he gave us, who believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I to think that I could oppose God?”

Slight misunderstandign here.

1: Not everyoen suffers ourgetory, only most do in Cahtolci thology.

2: Acts 11:17 was not talkign aboty all peple outside the Cahtolci chruc, but between the Jewish christians and Gentile Christains. The thory was hten that Jeuss Chirst came only o the Jews, while Paul opposed this veiw, sayign Jesus cist was for all.

3; The Catlci Churhc doesnt say you cant be saved and go to heaven if our not Cahtolci, only that its much, mich more difficult.

3) You believe that you must do 'good works' to get time off of your stay in purgatory and to get into Heaven, but then why does Peter state the following: Acts: 15:7-11 (primarily focusing on 15:11) After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9He made no distinction between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of the disciples a yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear? 11No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”

Catholics do not teach good works shortent he stay in Purgeory, rather what shrotes the stay in urgeory, or negates it, is th removal of sin by grace throgh repentence, reconciliation, and holy aspraiton.

Again, Purgetory is a place of purgation, to be pirged of any remainign sins, a sin canot enter Heaven, it is NOT a aplce to work off sins and you CANNOT do good works ot remit sin, you must confess sin and repent.

4) When Paul and others were taken to prison and a prison guard saved them, doesn't Paul tel the guard: Acts 16:31 "31They replied, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved–you and your household.”

Yes. Poitn being?

5) Again, wh is it so hard to accept people who are not Catholic: Romans 3:22 22This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference,

Cahtolci teachins is that all other banches of christendom are "Seperated Bretheren", who have part fo he turth, just not the fullness of truth. There is a distinction.

6) When was the last time a Protestant said they could be saved and that was it? Please read what the Bible states: Romans 3:31 31Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law. Again doesn't Jesus himself state: John 14:12 12I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.

OK, and?

7) What does the term Pope mean? I'm pretty sure from Latin it is some form of father correct? But doesn't Jesus in Matthew tell us: Matthew 23:9 9And do not call anyone on earth ‘father,’ for you have one Father, and he is in heaven

Pope means Father. Yes. as for the verse, tis been expaliend before, Ill leave it to another to post the link. Im only on this forum for a few minuets at the moment.

8) What Protestant tells you once s/he is saved it is over, game over, they win. Jesus himself tells us: Revelations 2:10 Do not be afraid of what you are about to suffer. I tell you, the devil will put some of you in prison to test you, and you will suffer persecution for ten days. Be faithful, even to the point of death, and I will give you the crown of life.

Its called the Doctorine of the Perserverenc of the saints, or Once Saved alays Saved, in popular venracular. Usually Calvinists hold this docotrien,a nd others who may not be Clavinists comeltley but share in Clavinistic leanings, such as the Southern Baptist Association.

Thanks for answering any and al questions you can.

yOUR WLECOME, SORRY THE ANSWERS ARE SHORT, AS i SIAD TIME PRSSURES HERE.

Haved a blessed day.

You to.

-- ZAROVE (ZAROFF3@JUNO.COM), February 15, 2005.

Jesse: Non-Catholics aren't bashed here if they show respect for the forum and for our faith.

Eve then, if they're disrespectful, we don't trash them. We dispute the false things they push, and we show them their mistakes. When they say something in good faith, as you sometimes do, we even agree.

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), February 15, 2005.

Zarove answered your questions quite well, but I would like to add a few things.

"When Paul and others were taken to prison and a prison guard saved them, doesn't Paul tel the guard: Acts 16:31 "31They replied “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved–you and your household.”"

Exactly, you WILL be saved. Paul doesn't say, "Believe in the Lord and be saved." Your choice of quote actually negates a large part of protestant theology. You have not BEEN saved. You WILL be saved.

"5) Again, wh is it so hard to accept people who are not Catholic: Romans 3:22 22This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference."

Catholics are not the ones who did not accept Protestants. Protestants protested against the Catholic Church, refusing acceptance in the One, True Church. Catholics do accept the actual Protestant people, but we will not accept your divergent beliefs that stray from the Truth.

"When was the last time a Protestant said they could be saved and that was it? Please read what the Bible states: Romans 3:31 31Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law. Again doesn't Jesus himself state: John 14:12 12I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father."

I can't tell you the last time, but I can tell you one of the first times... "God does not save people who are only fictitious sinners. Be a sinner and sin boldly, but believe and rejoice in Christ even more boldly . . . as long as we are here [in this world] we have to sin. . . . No sin will separate us from the Lamb, even though we commit fornication and murder a thousand times a day" (Letter to Melanchthon, August 1, 1521, American Edition, Luther's Works, vol. 48, pp. 281-82)."

"What does the term Pope mean? I'm pretty sure from Latin it is some form of father correct? But doesn't Jesus in Matthew tell us: Matthew 23:9 9And do not call anyone on earth father, for you have one Father, and he is in heaven."

Let me throw another quote at you..."I became your father in Christ Jesus through the Gospel." 1 Corinthians 4:15. Yep, that's Paul talking.

Let me know what you think. I am sure others will thoroughly answer you in many different, correct ways.

Tim Kirschenheiter

-- Tim K. (tk4386@juno.com), February 15, 2005.

indulgences were sold to take away all your sins...

-- sdqa (sdqa@sdqa.Com), February 15, 2005.

Don't be a fool. Indulgences don't take away anything but your pain. Your sin must be forgiven first, before you feel pain, in Purgatory. Then an indulgence is like a pardon; get out of jail.

-- eugene c. chavez (loschavez@pacbell.net), February 15, 2005.

Now I really don't appreciate all the Protestant bashing, but hey this is a Catholic forum, so you will do as you wish. I'm pretty sure that I'm supposed to love and respect all, but hey what do I know right?

now, lets be honest, you didnt come here with an open mind and questions... you came here to show us catholics your wisdom and to teach us something. the problem is, we didnt jump on the bandwagon of protestant belief like you wanted us to and that irks you. I haven't seen anyone bash you in a personal attack, but rather i have seen alot of time put into correcting your misconceptions about the catholic church. THAT is respect and compassion for you, if we didnt care, we'd simply ignore you right off the forum.

1) God's gift is eternal life through Jesus Christ, correct? Purgatory is where you go because you have to work off your sins, correct? The Bible states Jesus died for all your sins, correct? However in the past, pre-Reformation, the Catholic Church sold Indulgences so someone would not have to stay in purgatory the entire time, correct? So why then does peter make the following statement: Acts 8:20 20Peter answered: “May your money perish with you, because you thought you could buy the gift of God with money!...?

first and foremost, purgatory is not where we "work off our sins." the nature of sin is that it is evil, and no amount of works that we do can make up for that evil. Purgatory, then, is where we go to ATONE for those sins. that is to say, we pray fervantly for forgiveness and bear the pain of our sins... indulgences do not purchase salvation, they are a form of sacrifice on the part of the self which remits some of the burden we must bear in atonement for our sin. we do not "buy the gift of God with money" but rather give freely of ourselves in an attempt to make the world a better place through charity.

2) You believe that you have to be a part of the Catholic Church to go to Heaven. However first you must suffer through purgatory before you do. And you believe that there is no salvation outside the catholic Church why then does Paul comment the following: Acts 11:17 17So if God gave them the same gift as he gave us, who believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I to think that I could oppose God?”

NO, NO, NO!!! we have told you this before, people outside the catholic church may be saved as well, people inside the catholic church may NOT be saved. but anyone who finds salvation does so through some measure of the truth of God's word which is preserved in fullness by the catholic church. YOU are the one who has said that there is no salvation outside the catholic church, not us catholics. the statement you are looking for is that there is no salvation outside of Catholic TRUTH which is contained in some measure by some of the other churches out there as well.

3) You believe that you must do 'good works' to get time off of your stay in purgatory and to get into Heaven, but then why does Peter state the following: Acts: 15:7-11 (primarily focusing on 15:11) After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9He made no distinction between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of the disciples a yoke that neither we nor our fathers have been able to bear? 11No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”

there is a distinct difference between salvation and life according to the Word. salvation comes through grace by our faith that, despite the failure of our works to meet the burden of our sins, we are forgiven by an ever merciful and gracious God. THAT is salvation. we know that our works are but little when weighed against our sins. however, go to bible.com and look up the word works in the bible. you will quickly find that we are called to a life of good works REGARDLESS of their effect on our salvation. that is what it means to live life according to the word of God.

6) When was the last time a Protestant said they could be saved and that was it? Please read what the Bible states: Romans 3:31 31Do we, then, nullify the law by this faith? Not at all! Rather, we uphold the law. Again doesn't Jesus himself state: John 14:12 12I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.

read the archives of the forum, protestants talk about how they are saved no matter what all the time around here. of course, not all protestants believe this way, with THOUSANDS of conflicting denominations of protestantism, you can pick and choose your church until you find one that is about what YOU believe, rather than what God prescribed... which is the belief held by the ONE, HOLY, CATHOLIC, and APOSTOLIC church. (these are the four marks by which we know that the catholic church is the church of Christ)

7) What does the term Pope mean? I'm pretty sure from Latin it is some form of father correct? But doesn't Jesus in Matthew tell us: Matthew 23:9 9And do not call anyone on earth ‘father,’ for you have one Father, and he is in heaven

pope doesnt translate directly to father, it means (literally) papa. however, the "call no man father" argument gets thrown about here all the time. simply put, the word used in this particular verse for father is ABBA, which translates to something along the lines of "Divine Father." there are actually multiple words for father in the hebrew, greek and aramaic languages, and this one is one which applies only to God... therefore the verse, properly understood, translates most accurately as "call no man on earth you Divine Father (ie ~ God)." Read the archives, this question has been answered hundreds of times.

-- paul h (dontSendMeMail@notAnAddress.com), February 15, 2005.

Paul,

"which is the belief held by the ONE, HOLY, CATHOLIC, and APOSTOLIC church"

I recently read a copy of the Apostle's creed that put an asterik next to Catholic and said in a footnote "Catholic refers to the universality of God's church, not specifically to the Roman Catholic Church." I guess after 1500 years the meaning had to be changed to coincide with new beliefs.

Tim

-- Tim K. (tk4386@juno.com), February 17, 2005.

It does refer to the universality of God's Church - the only Church that existed when the Creed was written - the true Church which God intended to be the one and only Church for all men, the universal Church.

-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), February 17, 2005.