False Domestic Violence Claims Destroys Marriages

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Dear Christian brothers and sisters,

The issue of the domestic violence industry was presented in this forum some years ago in a posting "Protection for Catholics against false domestic violence claims" If anything, over the last 2 years the domestic violence laws have increased in severity and the draconian methods propagated by the radical left wing feminist movement have prevailed.

The domestic violence industry is about breaking up the family unit for the profit and reward of the advocates that surround the divorce industry (ie. lawyers, women centers, Phycholigists, forensic accounts, Judges, social services etc.) Once invoked or a claim is made the family is on an immediate path to destruction and te complete draining of assets. Children are as lost as a vanished thought.

The new problem is that these laws are being used against women now in record numbers. It is not about protecting women who are beaten and battered. That old adage is just that.....old nonsence.

Of course no civil person wants to see any person battered....male or female. Of course, most all men would come to the aid and rescue of a battered person.

The claims being made are not about truely battered people. The invocation of domestic violence restraing orders are for the most part used to get a jump in divorce litigation and make sure that the divorce occurs. There is no avenue for reconsilation or a positive post divorce environment. It is apparent that the overwelmingly liberal States with their liberal family courts have put absolutely no value on marriage. All policies, laws, statues etc. that are suppose to protect the family unit are vanished. All laws that will generate extensive billable hours for lawyers have become the defacto standard in the matrimonial industry.

Its real easy for a womens shelter advocate, unethical lawyer or malitious scorned friend to suggest getting a restraining order. Just make a claim of "fear" for example and the complaintant automaticly gets the house, the kids, all assets and the other party is completely crimialized. Not based on fact and law but just an accusation. All done ex-parte' (that's without the other party present or able to defend themselves)

Oh, and yes completely unconstitutional!

Now who here knew that? And where is the ACLU????

............ Protecting terrorists and sueing Donald Rumsfeld of course!!

The issue is the billions in funding (our tax dollars) that pass down on the federal and state level into the coffers of the adovcacy groups ie. women shelters, who proclaim this problem is ever growing and out of control. The only thing out of control is the women shelter movement. The same applies to the abortion industry....its about the billions of our tax dollars that go into the "pro choice" aganda.

Violence in families is not out of control, the system that advocates for the protection of women is.

Lets see all the industries that follw the same victim stratagy as the domestic violence industry.

Child abuse industry

Rape (sexual) abuse industry

Elder abuse industry

Domestic violence industry

School harrassment industry

Abortion industry

Church (priest) abuse industry

Are we seeing a pattern yet?

Its called create a cause that identifies a new "victim class" , pressure our legislators to pass laws that will initiate new and continued funding for the cause and use that money to line the coffers of the radical left wing radical feminist agenda. Its also currently known as "Victimology".

Naturally, with this funding they have absolutely no accountability or monitoring for the effectiveness of their programs.

As we investigate each of these we see the anti-men, anti-children, anti-church,anti-marriage, anti-religion, anti-heterosexual women aganda surface. We see causes like Pro-Chioce, Pro-gay, Pro-Lesbian, Pro-transgender causes pushed into our schools and onto our children.

We see divorce at record levels because it is so easy and legally with the use of domestic violence laws one party can get everything for the asking.

We see grass root organizations begin to sprout up with the same infrastructure as the NOW organization.

For example, when the church abuse scandle was being sensationalized in the media a new group formed called "the voice of the faithful". Out of nowhere....fully funded...websites...marketing...etc. These people had an agenda that was a clear attack against the Catholic Church and the Holy Sea. Driven not to help others but to divide the Catholic Church and its followers. This group has far more backing that a few outraged parisheners.

We see human rights issues being pitted against marriage and man when the gay marriage issue is pushed through the courts via activist Judges against the will of the people.

Gay marriage means our children will be forced and indoctrinated in schools to not only accept the gay aganda but taught that this lifestyle is perfectly normal and acceptable, so why not try it out. Hence, bi-sexuality in young women is at an all time high in todays society. We see it on TV, in the media, etc. and it is being forced upon us. Certainly, being tollerant of other peoples preferance is ok, but having it legislatively imposed on society against the will of the people is wrong.

Its time all Christians stand up for their beliefs and expose the truth. Its time to get involved in the legislative process in this country and demand accountability and repeal of mans law that is designed and calculated to destroy life and the family unit.

Remember the devils greatest trick is convincing others that he or she doesn't exist.

-- M Silver (augiepal2000@yahoo.com), March 10, 2005

Answers

I'm sorry... what was your question? Oh, I see it now. You're using this forum for political purposes rather than authentic inquiry.

Thank you for your rant, with all of its myriad grammatical errors.

God bless, MVB

P.S.: The name of the state that includes the territory of Vatican City is called the "Holy See," not s-e-a.

-- MVB (mvbtwin@yahoo.com), March 11, 2005.


"Oh, I see it now. You're using this forum for political purposes rather than authentic inquiry."

It may appear that way BUT what he brings up very clearly is a real issue of Anti-Religion, Family (anti-anything functionally good for society) agendas. And must NOT be ignored AND must be Understood by people of Faith.

Think about it.

You get into an argument with a Homosexual (non-violent but loud); later he accuses you of having hit him. No longer would the charge filed be battery but he can simply say You assaulted him because he was gay-- Simple battery charge now becomes a HATE CRIME! Much harsher penalties. Same with Racial Hate Crimes and types which can also be classified as a hate crime for added punch when that is NOT the real issue.

Other issues of homosexual acceptance being brought into the schools to teach your kids is real, now starting as low as Kindergarten.

Google the term GLSEN or better yet GLSEN in Boston. And see what you can get.

So his post really does focus as well on the Religious aspect and should not be ignored as simply a political statement.

-- Michael G. (NoEmail@Nowhere.no), March 11, 2005.


As a worker in a battered women shelter I am not surprised in the slightest at Christianity's hatreed of what we do. Instead of ordering the women to apologize for making their husbands mad enough to beat them to a pulp we dare to tell the women they do not have to put up with the violence.

I understand that violates your religion's laws as it dares to say women are human beings and not incubators for male sperm.

-- Livia (no.where@com.net), March 11, 2005.


In fact, the Church runs many such shelters, offering women real help in difficult situations. Particularly in the area of inappropriate pregnancies, mothers are assisted in making healthy choices which will best ensure their own physical and emotional health, and that of their child. Unlike secular "women's centers" which simply encourage the woman to kill her son or daughter, then kick her out the door to live the rest of her life in guilt.

-- Paul M. (PaulCyp@cox.net), March 11, 2005.

The Catholic Church doesn't teach nonsense like that, Livia--you obviously have us confused with some other religion.

And battered women's shelters don't help, they just provide jobs for people who would otherwise be on welfare through lack of real job skills.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), March 11, 2005.



You clearly approve and are no doubt even guilty of abusing women. I see your type all the time threatening me at the shelter where I work.

We do not provide or perform abortions. We help women who are beaten by their Christian husbands (no doubt the husbands beat their wives out of love) find legal resources.

I understand you hate and dispise "uppity" women like me who dare to think we are actually human beings with souls and with political right.

I am sure one day a holy man like you will beat me to death in the name of Jesus. Then you will be well on your way to establishing your Theocracy. Good luck.

-- Livia (no.where@com.net), March 11, 2005.


I am female, so everything you just wrote was a real hoot to read. If you REALLY believed in empowerment for women you would suggest a good, solid, martial-arts-based self- defense course. End of problem.

But since you don't, you just encourage dependence of a different sort. one which just conveniently lines your pockets.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), March 11, 2005.


If you are a female them you are one who obviousely enjoying being abused and treated as mere chattel. If so good for you. Enjoy.

I am NOT rich beause of my job. Unlike your "church" which covets wealth in all its forms.

But I am sure I provide you and your religious zealots/terrorists with no end of amusement. You clear hatred of my very existence is quite apparent in your responses.

You reference to martial arts is a real hoot for me. Your zealots hate martial arts and certainly do NOT approve of women taking it. I do take AND teach martial arts to women for free. But of course I am sure that violates yet another edict in your Theocracy.

-- Livia (no.where@net.com), March 11, 2005.


Livia...lighten up. Noone here hates you or the shelter that you work for. I'm sure you're performing a wonderful service, and as a Catholic I am certainly against beating women (or any violence, for that matter). But if you go through the original post with an open mind, instead of feeling like you are being personally attacked, you will see that the author is simply pointing out some disturbing social trends in this country. What happened to innocent until proven guilty? Yes, there are many men (and women), Catholic and Christian among them, who do abuse their spouses, and they should be rightfully punished for it. BUT, the point made is that many innocent suffer as a result of simple accusation. God bless!

-- Mike (n@n.n), March 11, 2005.

Well, the original post is just so much drivel, too (and it doesn't help that there are quite a few spelling errors).

The main problem I have with Livia's posts is that she obviously hasn't a clue as to what the Catholic Church teaches, and is apparently confusing it with right-wing Fundamentalism.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), March 11, 2005.



so much drivel Yes, true that may be. Unfortunately not everyone who posts here may excel at the english language, but I think they should be encouraged to post none-the-less. As long as you understand the point of what the author is stating, then so be it. After all, this is the Catholic forum, not the English 101 forum ;-)

IMHO, a little more understanding of these things may be in order on this forum...

-- Mike (n@n.n), March 11, 2005.


Thank You MVB for the spell check advice.

Regarding your statement of this being a political message:

Marriage , Family and Birth Rights are of paramount concern to the Catholic Church, Christians and most all civilized religions for that matter.

Marriage is under attack via the current domestic violence laws. Laws designed to help the injured are being used for litigation purposes and not to help people. If the people behind the broad and unmonitored applications of these laws happen to be from a particular political party with extremist views then Christians must understand who they are and do not accept who they claim to be on the surface, but truely take the time to understand their infrastructure, their leaders, their affiliations and their cash flow. (ie. Voice of the faithful)

Once you do this you will see the previous mentioned industries are similar in nature and in some cases the same.

At that point you make the choice of adhearing to your moral Christian beliefs/values and standing up for them or do nothing and pretend it doesn't exist.

There are three kinds of people in this world:

1) People who watch things happen

2) People who make things happen

3) and people who wonder what happen?

Its time to stop wondering what happen sir;.... learn the issues and make your choice heard.

What political party

-- M Silver (augiepal2000@yahoo.com), March 11, 2005.


Livia,

Unfortunately, much of the mantra that is taught at women shelters is not designed to bring (all) people together in peace and harmany. Remember, you are involved in a business entity that operates under the guise of helping battered women.

Its easy to throw around the term battered or abused and shock the sences of most resonable thinking people, however when the general public see the marketing material used by womens centers that takes subjective feelings and attempts to call it actual beating...battering...physical violence....that is just plain wrong.

The problem is that the women shelters are faced with is that because the womens against domestic violence act filtered billions of dollars into the shelter system( for women only)and they desire continued funding....they need to make up statisticly the issue of actual violence to be greater then it is.

Why can't shelters be universal? Men, women and all sorts.

Why are the shelter personal so adverse to any person holding them accountable for our tax dollars they recieve?

Why is there an immediate jump to a gender war and bashing of Church values?

Why are there accusations that the Church believes in hurting women?

Now since you are so intimate with this womens shelter...why not disclose for the forum the reading materials handed out from your shelter?

Lets discuss the reading from the women studies courses that are taught at many universities that promote Goddess worship, witchcraft and anti-men, anti-family sentiment.

Maybe what is taught needs to be shown to main stream Catholic women.

Maybe when Catholic women see what is truely behind the scenes at the women shelters and understand that shelters do not represent the best interest of children, families and respect for all gender

Lets discuss the fact that women's studies degreed people are geered to work at womens shelters and become fund raising advocates for the radical womens movement.

The women shelter cause is essentially feeding the divorce system since today, over 95 percent of the claims of domestic violence are for non violent things.

Example....I feel oppressed as a women......I fear for my safty etc.

Whith the passage of such claims good men and families are emotionally, financially destroyed with no possibility of reconsiliation even in cases where no violence has ever occured.

Today many women have this false domestic violence claim pulled on them during divorce litigation. Good hard working women, with children and education and strong moral values. Its essentially the biggest financial scam traversing the country today. All essentially propagated to destroy families and shift the wealth of the family unit to lawyers and the folks that surround the industry.

When there are such a large percentage (over 90 percent) of claims being made for non violent events, the serious cases where women (and sometimes men)really need help are not taken seriously.

The Domestic violence shelter movement hurts and destroys families. It is clear from your responces that your anger and distain for the opinion of others is shown.

Remember the greatest trick of the devil is to convince people that he/she doesn't exist.

-- M Silver (Augiepal2000@yahoo.com), March 11, 2005.


Yes it is true I do need to lighten up. I am harsh because Christians are harsh. They can dish it out but refuse to take it.

M Sliver is very clearly a woman hater. No doubt he rapes and beats women as often as he can. If M Silver is a female clearly she is so brain washed by Christian propoganda that she enjoys being beaten and abused.

The reading materials I hand out are related to law. It shows that it is wrong to beat and abuse women. I know those are completely against everything Christianity teaches but I WILL NOT appologise.

I've seen some women beaten so badly they are crippled for life. I myself was beaten so badly by a Christian (very devout) man that I can no longer have children even if I wanted to. I understand that being unable to bear children makes me even lower in the eyes of your God. But that is OK I do support your freedom to worship whatever religion you choose

-- Livia (no.where@net.com), March 11, 2005.


Livia...please, when you are ready to have a rational conversation, please let me know. But to rant like you are really only makes you look silly. Like I stated before, neither I nor anyone here hates you, and for you to make ludicrous irrational claims that "M Silver must rape and beat women" simply because he introduced a thought for rational discussion is simply irrational.

Let me know when you are ready to apologize (not for being beaten by a man, but for your hotheadedness) and we will gladly discuss anything you wish.

Remember, God gave you 1 mouth and 2 ears...listen twice as much as you speak and you just might learn something that you did not know before.

God Bless!!

-- Mike (n@n.n), March 11, 2005.



I have never had a "rational" conversation with a religious zealot/terrorist. But that is my fault. I can not expect such from zealots. I do often expect far too much.

-- Livia (no.where@net.com), March 11, 2005.

M Silver,

False reports of anything are wrong. Educating women as to what and what does not constitute abuse does not necessarily fall into that category. Spouses should OF COURSE feel safe in their marriage. You shouldn't be yelling at each other, what the heck kind of marriage is that?

I do feel it is truly unjust to make ONLY people applying for marriage licenses pay a fee/ tax for domestic violence programs, because it's probably fair to say that most domestic violence occurs in "shack up" situations.

I also feel that shelters FAIL in their prime directive, when many of those who seek help rebuilding their lives willingly go back to the deadbeats time and again. All the money in the world isn't going fix a bad system, and shelters do a terrible job of teaching self- esteem.

-- GT (nospam@nospam.com), March 11, 2005.


With that attitude and front, it's no wonder!! That would be like me saying that I never had a rational conversation with a (doctor/lawyer/black/chinese/etc...) because they are all irrational. Maybe it would be me that should open my eyes at that point and realize that maybe all members of any group are individuals and all have their own personalities, and maybe I shouldn't judge the entire group by my limited experience with a few of the members?

Anyhow, let me know when you are ready.

-- Mike (n@n.n), March 11, 2005.


"Yes it is true I do need to lighten up. I am harsh because Christians are harsh. They can dish it out but refuse to take it."

Livia,

I suspect about 85% of your clients have a Christian spouse right? This would approx match the fact that approx. 85% of this country practices some form of Christianity.

It is regrettable that you have chosen to link Religion to a Social problem. The 2 do NOT go hand in hand in this country the way you have decided that they do.

In fact IF you actually opened yourself up to some Rational conversation you really may find out that Catholics and most other mainstream denominations offer a great deal of support for women/families in such situations. If you have had nothing but confrontations with the "zealots" it may be because of your attack position.

Do yourself and maybe other women who do or have suffered ACTUAL Spousal abuse a favor by putting down your guns and open yourself up to some rational conversation on this topic.

Otherwise you will have chosen to do what you accuse others of having done. In which no one benefits and you do nothing for your cause.

-- Michael G. (NoEmail@Nowhere.no), March 11, 2005.


Wow!....WOmen hater....Rapes and beats women! or if female you are brainwashed by Christian doctrine and enjoy beatings???

THis is a wonderful example of how women shelter advocates react when questioned. Could one just imagine this individual giving advice to another.

Accuse the person of Rape....accuse the person of battering and if a women (obviously referring to heterosexual women) then you are brainwashed. Then attack the Church as some Zealots out to hurt women.

It is this logic that is completely irrational.

It is this logic that has control of billions of our tax dollars and uses it to destroy families. Nothing was ever said against women or bad about women, just asking for the marketing material that the shelter pushes on many vulnerable women and the public.

These are examples of the battle crys for the radical feminist movement. We were raped and you are a rapest....You (man ) are the batterer and we are battered.

Shall we go on.

You see once we uncover the devil he/SHE spits back flames and runs for cover. He/SHE fears the light. He/SHE does not cherish peace and harmony. He/SHE wants to see disharmany between the genders because this breaks up families and this is his/HER will.

As Christians we must be vigilant in asking pointed questions which uncover the truth. AS you look into each industry mentioned in the original post the same kind of reaction of hatred and disemination occurs. There is only room for perpetual controversy.

-- M Silver (augiepal2000@yahoo.com), March 11, 2005.


Thank you everyone.

You have provided clear and undeniable proof that Christianity is a purely evil organization.

M Silver hates me because I am not promoting abuse of women. I am not submissive and silent as his faith DEMANDS

The ONLY difference between Christianity and the Taliban is the Taliban do not beleive Jesus was the Savior/Son of God.

Thank you all once again. I can rely on religious zealots to always prove their group-think mentality and their overwheling hatred of anyone not of their faith and dares even suggest women have rights.

-- Livia (no.where@net.com), March 11, 2005.


President Bush's Faith "based Initiative" is essentialy founded on passing the billions of our tax dollar not just to secular based groups such as women shelters but also to faith based groups such as thoses sponcered with the moral and ethical values of the Catholic Church.

Its about helping people in need of help. Not creating statisticly impossible mantra to create problems and malitiously rip apart families and relationships for profit and additional free funding.

If one follows the cash flow and the true purpose of the women's shelter movement one will find it is about creating revenue through the propagation of destuction of others (mainly families,children and men).

The Catholic Church and its affiliates have helped families without the help of government funds ( our hard earned tax dollars). This help is for all families,women and men.

So if Acts of Congress have appropriated billions of dollars through such things as the womens against domestic violence act then why not share that funding with all groups that want to help women and families?

Why is the money only filtered to women shelters that are backed by radical militant feminist teachings?

President Bush asked " Why are faith based groups discriminated against when it comes to funding for social services issues?

Maybe the folks at the women shelters can answer this??

-- M Silver (augiepal2000@yahoo.com), March 11, 2005.


The so called "Faith based" funding program is simply a way for His Imperial Majesty George II, the Theocrat to annahilate non-Chrsitians.

The shelters, assuming Christians would even have them, would deny help to non-Christians unless they converted.

Christianity's goal is to wipe out all other faiths by any means necessary. History proves this.

-- Livia (no.where@net.com), March 11, 2005.


"The so called "Faith based" funding program is simply a way for His Imperial Majesty George II, the Theocrat to annahilate non- Chrsitians. The shelters, assuming Christians would even have them, would deny help to non-Christians unless they converted."

Livia, You continue to let your ignorance show! give it up now.

*Are you aware that Catholic Charities IS the Countries largest health provider?

*Are you aware that Catholic Charities has lost some of it's rights as a Religious Charity because it does NOT force people to listen to Scripture or Church teachings in order to qualify.

*Are you aware that Catholic Charities Does NOT Care who or what you are, They have ONE mission and that IS to Serve those who need help NO other Qualifiers. Black, White, male, female, Muslim, Hebrew, Hindu, NOTHING it make NO difference.

THAT is what being a Catholic IS about!

-- Michael G. (NoEmail@Nowhere.no), March 11, 2005.


"You have provided clear and undeniable proof that Christianity is a purely evil organization. "

"M Silver hates me because I am not promoting abuse of women. I am not submissive and silent as his faith DEMANDS "

Livia, quite the contrary,

Nobody hates you and nobody is promoting abuse of anyone.

I offer you my love, I offer you peace and harmony in you life. I offer you friendship. I offer you the hope that one day you will be in a loving relationship. I offer you my forgiveness so you can make your own choices.

I will pray for you and Gods blessing in your daily life.

-- M Silver (augiepal2000@yahoo.com), March 11, 2005.


I have been consistently denied help and Catholic "charities" because I am a non-Christian. Oh by the way I did not go their asking for abortions or artificial birth control as I KNOW you will imply. I simply went for help and was denied on the basis of NOT being a Christian.

So you claim is clearly false. But thanks for your concern

-- Livia (no.where@net.com), March 11, 2005.


Livia,

Did you go into this Catholic charity the same way you came into this forum? Calling people zealots, brain-washed, terrorists, and rapists?

Do you realize that no one on this forum has showed the slightest bit of evil sentiment towards you? Even though you have continually attacked Christianity, everyone here tries to reason with you and love you, and you somehow misconstrue it to be hate.

-- Tim K. (tk4386@juno.com), March 12, 2005.


"as I KNOW you will imply"

No Livia, I would not imply such a thing. Since you have not stated anything about what you requested help for. I can assure you it was NOT because of your Religious background.

Perhaps you had speculated about why your request may have been denied, Was it out of the scope of their agency? Did they refer you to an agency that actually dealt with what you needed.

You have provided nothing other then your dislike of any Religious based organizations. If life has truely and unfairly dealt you a bad hand I am sorry for you, I hope that at some point you choose to come off your attack systems for a while and see that there really are a great deal of people willing to (and DO help ) people in the spot you are/have been in. But if you are sincere without any agendas I suspect you can find a lot of help here alone.

So I will join with M Silver and others, by praying to God that YOU are able to find Love, Peace and Happiness in your life.

-- Michael G. (NoEmail@Nowhere.no), March 12, 2005.


Livia,

Take charge of yourself.

-- Daniel Hawkenberry (dlm@catholic.org), March 12, 2005.


I understand how the written word of M. Silver sounds very extreme. His tone makes him sound harsh but his intent is correct in some cases. As a Catholic man it is appalling that women are abused physically and mentally and that situation deserves due process. But the reality is that in divorce it becomes a matter of money and custody with people that fall out of love and can't dissolve the marriage in Christ-like way. My marriage is in trouble and my wife has aggressively pursued the domestic violence issue for the last couple years since she may have fallen out of love in our marriage. I don't touch my wife or abuse her. We do have our share of arguments that hurt fellings and are the fault of my own and my wife's. I have enough common sense and a good counselor to understand every person brings their share 50/50. But to be convinced after being educated by pychologists and attorneys of the definition of domestic violence, I can tell you it has been the very destruction of our marriage. As a devote Catholic herself and a I feel my wife truly needs a reason out of the marriage and to command control of custody....something as she has told me in many, many hurtful ways. I now feel that I am being abused with the very painful accusations my wife makes but as a man find it hard to claim the same.

I will continue to trust in God and work to make my marriage work and stay with my kids and wife who I love with all my heart !

-- Jay (wockame@aol.com), March 13, 2005.


I was just advised by a good friend and spiritual advisor I should never have even contacted anyone here. So there for I apologize for ever even saying a word here.

My friend reminded my of a quote: "Do not try to understand them and do not have them try to understand you. For they are a breed apart and make no sense." The "they" refers to Christians of course.

So once again I apologize for ever even saying a word to anyone here.

Good bye. Enjoy your season of Lent and Easter. - Livia

-- Livia (no.where@net.com), March 14, 2005.


Livia - I'm going to pray for you today. May the Lord heal your heart and bring you a soothing peace.

-- Dee (Dee@none.sorry), March 14, 2005.

M Silver,

Let me add this that I read elsewhere:

Both domestic abuse & domestic violence are evil. However, where many may disagree is in two areas: 1.) What constitutes violence & 2.) The prevalence of both domestic abuse & domestic violence.

One project that requires effort is the debunking of the social engineering propaganda that underlies the propaganda...

Some take the politically incorrect position on this issue and would suggest that the research and studies supporting wide prevalence of domestic abuse(violence) are faulty in many ways including method, results and prescription.

As to method, the research (e.g. Duluth) is scientifically unsound containing wishful contrivance similar to the once touted Kinsey Report. The research (propaganda) goes unquestioned and has circulated like a virus most assuredly rooted in the extreme elements of the feminist movement. The research goes unquestioned due to fear of reprisal -reprisal similar to that levied against those who take the politically incorrect position and oppose the ludicrous hate crime legislation initiatives.



-- Daniel Hawkenberry (dlm@catholic.org), March 14, 2005.

M Silver,

-continued:

As to results, the research and its proponents broadly define almost any contentious relational activity as abusive and then go further by claiming anything abusive to be violence. The research samplings are based upon only reported 'crimes' and not on actual determinations AND the sampled population involves all manner of relationships including severely disordered, homosexual, unmarried, etcetera...

"Domestic" means something quite different than what some would assume. As a result, today the terminology is blurred to the point that everything within a broad spectrum from alleged verbal & mental abuse to actual assault & murder are called domestic violence.

According to the research findings one would conclude that distinction not important anyway because it is all just violence with intent to abuse -abuse and violence that will always escalate and progressively becomes more violent over time -both incurable and inevitable once diagnosed.

So the research and studies have determined that there is a disease or sickness that society must be wary of. [It] displays indicators to be noted and [it] provides prescriptive measures to be taken.

Well, some questions: -who diagnoses? Can it be diagnosed without objective testing? Can diagnosis be made by proxy without seeing the disordered individual? Does it matter that indicated conditions such as verbal abuse are not even recognized disorders by the APA -hence, there are no tests -that [it] is all subjective?



-- Daniel Hawkenberry (dlm@catholic.org), March 14, 2005.

M Silver,

-end:

Regarding prescription, many examples bring up a good point that is overlooked by many. Real facts are required -facts to dispel the folklore and agenda driven propaganda that causes great harm to society. Court orders, legal or civil actions, restraints and or separations do not prevent actual and dangerous abusers or violent perpetrators. Court orders, legal or civil actions, restraints and or separations similar to social witch hunts only cloud issues, harm the common good and do not prevent a person that is going to pursue abuse or violent crime.

All violent criminals, who allegedly commit violent acts should be prosecuted for violent crime and guilt should objectively be determined by competent authority based upon the facts -period. Only objective fact should determine both individual guilt and societal prevalence regarding this issue. Justice demands it...



-- Daniel Hawkenberry (dlm@catholic.org), March 14, 2005.

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